My console says "slap stick" but it will not slap 1 to 2, and 2 to D.
Taking it out shows why...the keying doesn't seem to support it.
Top picture is in second gear. The "key" is obstructed.
Bottom picture is frost gear. The "key" is also obstructed.
Slapping works from R to N to D. And from D to N.
But why not 1 to 2 to D?
Lube it & play with it.... They 100% support slap shifting....
What lube is best? Lithium white grease spray, actual grease from a can, etc?
Try the spray grease... Shouldn't take much..
I don't think any about of lube is going to get this key to slide out of second into D...
And yeah, I did already spray grease before I did a deep cleaning.
What the f.
The detent moves, it's spring loaded...
That "plate" that the key rides on is not camed either, like you would think. It has no give....
See where the spring attaches...... That should move...
Only up or down...which requires pushing the button.
Not left or right....
Am I missing a spring? I wonder if that has something to do with it....
EDIT: found the spring in a parts box. Makes the button a lot nicer, but nope...she ain't slappin...
T=handle but I believe the operation is the same... Reverse to Neutral does not require pushing the button.
Notice the slight pull back required to go 2nd to 3rd
"Notice the slight pull back required to go 2nd to 3rd "
When the shifter is working properly you shouldn't need to pull back..... Take the pressure off, yes, pull back.. No...
Mine does not support that 1 - 2 - D like his...
I can make a video. There may be a worn part or a part missing. The fact that from 2 to D requires a slight backwards actually leads me to believe that the plate is cammed....mine is not...
Early A66. I hope I can figure it out.
Try backing the push button out a couple turns... Then try shifting...
How can the detent over come steps like shown in the picture. Isn't this basic physics?
The only what is if the "plate" enters some sort of mode when shifted into 1 or 2, where the plate is automatically lowered so that the detent can "ride up" the steps. Or if it's a more complex mechanism and is cammed...
(Shifter detent in "N")
Button is already at .4" height per FSM...
Moved the button to .65" height (looks funny) and didn't help.
Honestly, I've never studied how they work.... I've owned allot of them & they just work....
Haha!
Does anyone have one of these on the shelf that they can take a picture of so we can compare?
I wish mine worked. I down shift a lot and I have to fiddle with the button.
The only other thing I can think of is if this spring is not stock and is too stiff...
Doubtful, and I'm grasping at straws.
I don't even own a slapstick equiped car, but am fascinated to see how this turns out!
Quote from: kawahonda on August 31, 2018, 08:49:53 PM
Haha!
Does anyone have one of these on the shelf that they can take a picture of so we can compare?
I wish mine worked. I down shift a lot and I have to fiddle with the button.
They only " slap stick" going from 1st to D, yes you will need to fiddle with the button to downshift. That's how they are designed to function.
Yes. I cannot upshift in slap stick.
I'm at the point where I need to see other shifters...
I've got 4-5 of them in my junk collection but not where I am currently.... I need to go look for some other parts so I'll try to get photo's tomorrow...
Mine didn't work after sitting 10+ years but some PB Blaster & exercising it a few times things started clicking like they should.... Yours may take a little more persuasion but I"m sure it will work well eventually :cheers:
I wil just add on here, they work as said above, push button fome any gear to down shift, once in 1, slap/ push up one gear and you have the relase presure to go to the next. Push button to go form D to N.
Never really looked at how the worked either, mine just always did.
Jason
I would have to dig one out to take photos. I know one thing for certain if the button is screwed down too far it will affect the slap stick feature and it won't work correctly. Logic indicates pushing the button even a bit would override the gate that stops the shifter.
I look forward to what you guys can find.
I'm curious when the "pin" hits the gate step (on the "plate), how the does it somehow "walk up" it. Does the plate somehow automatically move down to allow it to take step upwards just with a forward motion of the shifter (mechanically, I don't know how this works)?
Or does the "pin" rotate and "push" it down on it's own? Those are things I need to know in order to figure out what's going on.
Right now, the pin just hits the gate step and it ain't doing nuthin' It's been sprayed with brake cleaner, sprayed with lithium grease. I even greased it up manually with red synthetic grease.
I looked everywhere for good photos. Found nothing.
This is a post of mine from a long time ago. https://forum.e-bodies.org/engine-transmission-and-rear-end/4/slap-stick-shifter-loose/3470/
You should be able to "slap" it into 2nd, then again 3rd WITHOUT touching the botton, it should be an easy "slap"
I now wish I had a 4 speed, but whenever I want to play I always use the slap stick option as its more fun.
it should move 1-2 then if you release the pressure it will move 2-3 & lock out N until the button is pushed once pushed it will move back & forth between D & N
adjustment of the linkage is critical , it can take have an hour or so of constant adjustments to get it just right even when the shifter is working perfectly
I've got one sitting here... The plate not only moves up & down but it rocks slightly (close to 3/16" maybe 1/4")....
First picture shifter pulled back to 2nd position.... Detent plate is in it's natural position....
Second picture shifter pulled back to 2nd position... Detent plate rocked forward.... I used a small screwdriver to rock it so the movement would be apparent.. Normal shifting the movement is hard to spot....
Thanks Wild, that helps. So basically, the plate should move forward about at 1/4". That explains how it works. My plate does not rotate.
This pretty much shows how much the plate should rotate.
Second picture shows the plate and the cavity which it is in. You can see that's there's no room for rotation...
Randy, not sure if your able to accept quick videos but I can text them to you...
Maybe you’ll be willing to part with one of your spare for this one as a core. Chrome shaft is in good shape, no pitting.
This is a mystery.
Notice how the left part of the plate.....mine is different. Yours is exposed, and then hidden when you pry it. Mine is always hidden, which means mine is always making contact on the left side as well as the right side.....I confirmed this by prying and not getting any movement.
Compare my and your photo, the plate is moved ALL the way to the right....you can clearly see this in the images because our plates are making contact on the right side.
The difference is that your plate must be narrower, allowing a sideways rotation when the "pin" hits the plate to allow for rotation. My version has the plate making contact on both sides of the casing, therefor, no sideways rotation. No rotation = No slapstick.
It seems mine was built incorrectly from Chrysler in that my plate is too wide to support any type of lateral rotation to support slapstick.
I wonder if this is some sort of blunder that went through? Maybe it's worth something? :headbang: :)
Who has a nice shifter mechanism that I can buy! Don't need the knob, button, button spring, or mech spring. Just a working slap-stick with good chrome that works good.
Cody, I'm jealous! :)
Now that I know the mechanism really well, yours is working very nice! :)
Hopefully people have a bunch of nice spares sitting around!
I think I have a bunch of them in a box in the shop. You're going to make me go look now aren't you.
Also a tip...maybe you knew it...but based on the mechanism, you can shift from R -> N -> D without using the button. Maybe that tip (you probably around knew it though) may give you an incentive to go look for a nice spare. :)
So every time you back up....just slap it to "D"...won't create any wear.
I'm trying here....:)
And from there bumping it back & forth from drive to neutral as often as you like without touching the button... But once you push the button & pull it back you get two bumps then it locked into drive..... Tap down once & your back to free movement from drive to neutral...
Really a very well designed shifter.. Far superior to GTO's optional "Dual Gate"..... Just doesn't work with reverse pattern valve bodies....
Maybe a problem with quality control though. :)
Quote from: kawahonda on September 01, 2018, 08:17:22 PM
Maybe a problem with quality control though. :)
Never seen one with a problem before... I'm betting there's something else going on....
The ones I've had in my hand have always worked, but some of them need a little lube to make work smooth. It's a pretty simple design so I'm guessing something else is going on with yours.
You guys are free to work on mine If you don’t think it’s a factory defect...
After 3 hours, I’m done with it.
I know a little about what I’m doing and how it should work. Metal cannot move when there isn’t room for metal to move.
I’m surprised my pictures did not effectively communicate this.
IMO if it is made wrong it wouldn't have worked properly when it was new, if thats the case it would have been replaced under warranty..
Only if the owner complained!
Maybe I should call FCA and file a claim. LOL.
At any rate, it's time for a new shifter.
Send it to me.....
Watch this video. Hopefully this helps explain why I am stumped.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVtneRq3rnM
:headbang: :headbang: :headbang:
Your video helps a lot. I'll need to get one of mine out and play with it to see what is going on. Have you tried to adjust the ball and button on the top? Not sure if that has anything to do with it or not, but I know I've had mine to tight in the past and it messed with the way it worked.
FWIW there is a mechanism that locks that plate.... I haven't identified what it is, I can see it, I only know the plate locks until you push the button..... Something on your shifter isn't releasing.... I think I'd remove the two rivets on the linkage side.... Once the plate is removed I think you'd find your issue....
Still up for me sending it out to you Randy? Hope you can post on this thread as a follow up.
Does it need to have the linkage hooked up to apply pressure for it to work properly?
I've got no skin in the game, but following out of interest. Could it be that kawahonda's mechanism is just a regular shifter and not supposed to be a slap stick? Either factory error upon installation or replaced incorrectly at some point?
In your video , It looks like there is a little notch on that rectangular piece that touches the ratchet could that be holding it up not letting it go past ?
Has it shipped yet?
The riveted cam plate is in the proper position. The leading edge (towards the dash) of your floating cam plate needs a small amount of material removed IF there is no debris in that front pocket.
I'm sure you have tried to use a pick to clean that pocket first.
It doesn't need linkage hooked up to work properly. :alan2cents:
No debris in pocket. Metal to metal contact...
In further examination, it appears that it's NOT making contact on the firewall side, so there is room for the plate to rotate. This is a slapstick shifter.
Something is keeping it locked...
Please post some call outs and I can look further. Wild, let me have a go at this to be sure. If I have to take out rivers then it's going to be sent to you!
I could be way off as I'm trying to go by memory here...but doesnt the threaded rod go all the way down and interact with the floating plate somehow? Maybe the end is bent or worn? To me it looks like the plate is not moving towards the spring side and is stuck forward?? :notsure:
That's correct. There is a rod that has a rubber tip. I believe it's job is to push the plate down when the button is pressed. I don't believe that it interacts with slap stick since the button should be used.
But you are right. My plate is stuck forward is a good way to say it.
Upon further inspection, the metal is indeed touching.
1 Wild, it's boxed up and will be heading your way soon.
Rubber tip ??? :huh:
Even if the riveted cam plate is slightly in the wrong position(too far rearward), i would not oblong the holes to move the cam forward and re-rivet. slamming gears could move it. I would still dress the leading edge of the floating cam, if no other suprizes appear when disassembled.
It arrived at 1 Wild's location. I'm excited to see WTF is going on.
If anyone can figure it out I would bet on 1 Wild RT! :takemymoney:
Wild will figure it out & maybe get it fixed unless it is terminal
I actually got it in my hands today but to many things around the house needed done to dig into it.... Maybe tomorrow.... It is an exceptionally clean piece so hopefully it won't be a big problem....
WTH? On the couch with a bagful of Cheetohs?
Quote from: RUNCHARGER on September 08, 2018, 08:13:49 AM
WTH? On the couch with a bagful of Cheetohs?
Watching Porn......
Ha, ha: How did I know you knew that joke...
Quote from: RUNCHARGER on September 08, 2018, 08:41:33 AM
Ha, ha: How did I know you knew that joke...
everyone knows that joke..... Well guys anyway.... :rofl:
Well after looking at the shifter for a couple days it was apparent the plate wouldn't swivel as it needs to & I couldn't be 100% sure why until some parts were disassembled.... Well I removed the first two rivets & still couldn't be sure so I remove the last two rivets & I can confirm the shifter was made wrong & hasn't worked since day one...... Very odd.... One of the plates is made wrong & without taking a good shifter apart I can't even say which part is wrong..... Oh well... It's back in the box along with a spare shifter I had.... Not quite as clean but close.... I'll try to get it shipped tomorrow....
I know the car is early but I've driven a pilot car Challenger with a working Slap Stik....
I also know of a pilot 440-6 4spd Challenger (JS27V0B1000027) that had no Hurst lettering on the original Pistol Grip....
:clapping: :worship:
Quote from: 1 Wild R/T on September 10, 2018, 03:36:43 PM
Well after looking at the shifter for a couple days it was apparent the plate wouldn't swivel as it needs to & I couldn't be 100% sure why until some parts were disassembled.... Well I removed the first two rivets & still couldn't be sure so I remove the last two rivets & I can confirm the shifter was made wrong & hasn't worked since day one...... Very odd.... One of the plates is made wrong & without taking a good shifter apart I can't even say which part is wrong..... Oh well... It's back in the box along with a spare shifter I had.... Not quite as clean but close.... I'll try to get it shipped tomorrow....
I know the car is early but I've driven a pilot car Challenger with a working Slap Stik....
I also know of a pilot 440-6 4spd Challenger (JS27V0B1000027) that had no Hurst lettering on the original Pistol Grip....
Super awesome, thanks for looking Randy.
Very appreciative of the working slap stick shifter you sent. Thank you. Maybe the original one should stay boxed up for a good discussion piece. :)
I'm glad that I wasn't crazy....I spent hours and hours looking at it and I couldn't figure it out. My best guess is that that "plate" in there is simply too big to rachet...something about it is made wrong from day 1. The previous owner probably babied the car and didn't care to slam through the gears...it was probably left undiscovered until now.
I'm guessing that using slapstick will be extremely fun and quite a necessary improvement.
Either plate could be trimmed slightly & made to work.. I just had a hard time believing it was made wrong but clearly it was..... I agree I looked & looked but till it came apart I couldn't be sure... Your shifter ball is still on the old shifter, I did try raising the button but it made no difference.... When you play with the new shifter you'll see there is an extra detent feel between N/D that your didn't have & the plate that needs to swivel does....
I was wondering that too. Based that there is no swivel-action with my old shifter, I wonder it turn creates more "slop" while it's in any gear. Now that there's a swivel, I would assume there's less space for the pin to move, therefore a more firm "feel" once you are in a gear....
Cool. Sounds like the shifter you included is an upgrade all around...
(https://orig00.deviantart.net/b38a/f/2018/024/0/1/monkey_s_uncle_by_razorrex-d7a1rkp.jpg)
everyone has made defective parts & that one slipped by QC
Wild is QC! Just late to the party this time.
Got randy's shifter in today and it's nice to experience how it works.
1-2 just with a flick. 2-D with a flick. Nice and tight.
Just soaked it in prep and etch. Had some light storage/shelf rust. Now she's new. I'll grease it up and install it this evening.
:iagree:
:clapping:
Before you slap that dude in, would it be possible for you to take a video of it working and post it here or email it? I'm sure others would learn from it, but I am having trouble with mine as well. It goes from 1st to Neutral without stopping. I haven't looked at it yet but when I do, a video would be very helpful to understand how the parts are supposed to move relative to one another.
I'll drink a couple beers and re-shoot a youtube video tonight.
The old shifter is apart so I cannot do a direct compare, but it will still be extremely helpful.
Decided to drink flavored vodka instead. Hopefully it's still informational. :)
:needphotos:
BTW, I identified two part numbers that were different compared to my original shifter. Most of them are the same part #.
Enjoy!
The center gate for neutral/drive is nice if you have to much cam & not enough convertor...... Glad you now know it isn't a lie....
Great that it got resolved.
Back to my original question, since there are part number differences, could kawahonda's original shifter be just a standard center console shifter and not supposed to be a slap stick? If the car was supposed to have a slap stick, perhaps the wrong shifter was installed at the factory or later, instead of the shifter made incorrectly?
Quote from: captcolour on September 15, 2018, 06:28:08 AM
Great that it got resolved.
Back to my original question, since there are part number differences, could kawahonda's original shifter be just a standard center console shifter and not supposed to be a slap stick? If the car was supposed to have a slap stick, perhaps the wrong shifter was installed at the factory or later, instead of the shifter made incorrectly?
All A/T floor shift E bodies got a slap stik..... All the shifters of that style are suppose to be slap stiks.... All the parts to make a slap stik work are present, just one part is made slightly wrong....
I have a 74 challenger with 904 automatic..and console shifter... BUT ...it does not say slap stick on it, and If i push the button down i can pull it back the entire way to first...and then without the button push it forward but no lock to prevent overshooting to D or neutral.
Weren't all of the E body console shifters supposed to be a slap stick?? Maybe someone replaced mine? What was the part number for the Correct slap stick model ?
Later on there were shifters like that in the Cordoba era cars that were not slap stics, however the Cordobas weren't manufactured until 1975.
Quote from: RUNCHARGER on September 15, 2018, 08:38:35 AM
Later on there were shifters like that in the Cordoba era cars that were not slap stics, however the Cordobas weren't manufactured until 1975.
Yup, bolts in & looks right... But it's not..
I too have a 1974 Challenger that I ordered in December of 1973. It had a 318 / 904 originally. The shifter is not labeled "Slap Stick" on the console plate. It works exactly as you described. I don't know if the slap stick was an option. I have the build sheet if anyone can decode it.
Welcome to the site , the slap stick should still ratchet through the gears & lock out reverse if it is pulled fully into 1st gear :wave:
Mine was labeled "slap stick" but likely never slap sticked!
I was watching the video this morning about how the slap stick wasn't working properly and the wife walked by and asked what is that. I explained the non working issue and she said....well, your slap stick doesn't work either! I thought that was kind of rude! :Thud: