Am seriously considering doing an EFI conversion on my Cuda. I currently have a Holley 80531 carb (440 motor) - has anybody done this and did you go with a Holley EFI option?
I'd appreciated any feedback, good or bad.
I have no experience but have been researching EFI as well. From what I understand if your engine has less that 10" of vacuum at idle in gear then the self learning throttle body types are not best suited for that engine. If you have a relatively stock engine they seem to work great. Holley, FAST, FI Tech are popular. It's best to have a return style of regulator for long pump life and cooler fuel.
I'm leaning towards a FAST sportsman or XFI 2.0 system because of the camshaft in my engine that produces about 6" of vacuum at idle in gear.
http://www.fastmanefi.com/
I built my own system using a variety of parts
For a computer I used SDSEFI , great system that comes complete with a handheld programmer , $1500
Bosch injectors - $800
Accufab Throttle body $400
Edelbrock Victor intake predrilled with fuel rails -$400
Bosh fuel pressure regulator - $180
I recommend the Tanks system tank & pump $500
For a bolt on throttle body system I think I would try the Holley setup. Almost everyone I have talked to lately with a Fitech has had some sort of issues. As stated above the throttle body setups work well with a mild engine.
I don't believe I'll ever diddle with a carb again unless it is a restored car. these new systems are pretty easy to install and tune even for an old guy like me.
I'm 2 weeks away from having the Holley Sniper EFI installed on my 505 stroker in the Charger and will let you know. :banana:
Looks like a great setup. My understanding is it works better when combined with their distributor.
https://www.google.com/amp/www.hotrod.com/articles/test-holleys-new-sniper-efi/amp/
I missed the part where it said it ran better with their distributor :clueless:
Quote from: Strawdawg on May 18, 2018, 07:46:36 AM
I missed the part where it said it ran better with their distributor :clueless:
I believe it runs better with their distributor because the Sniper is allowed to control the timing. So, if you have a distributor that is compatible with the Sniper timing control, not necessarily the Holley distributor, it would also run better.
That is correct. Sorry I was not more specific but that is my understanding.
BTW - I have the complete Holley Sniper System and their distributor on my bench and my brother has the MSD Atomic system.
I decided to go with this setup rather than the custom setup I got from Rich Nedbal in order to avoid cutting a hole in my firewall for the wiring harness.
If anybody is interested in a custom EFI system for a small block mopar with a F.A.S.T. EFI computer let me know ;).
After many iterations of various carburetors, I installed the FI Tech system last month on my 1970 383 Cuda. The install took one weekend, using the complete FI tech throttle body, and fuel pump system. I kept my existing MOPAR Electronic Ignition and distributor.
It runs better than it ever has. No issues or complaints yet. (and all reversible.)
I might have been happier with the in tank pump, and it probably would have cost about the same...but happy for now.
Yeah, I understood it to be a compatible aftermarket unit :)
The FITech and the Holley Sniper are the most attractive from my perspective. I would like to have more history with both of them to have an idea as to which has the better service record. I have not forgotten my experiences with a Holley tbi from the '80's but right now, I might be convinced to give Holley another shot.
The Sniper Master pack is a pretty good price as compared to getting an in the tank set up with a new tank. I would think the in tank set up would get longer pump life but that is pure conjecture on my part.
Quote from: ledphoot on May 18, 2018, 08:27:49 AM
That is correct. Sorry I was not more specific but that is my understanding.
BTW - I have the complete Holley Sniper System and their distributor on my bench and my brother has the MSD Atomic system.
I decided to go with this setup rather than the custom setup I got from Rich Nedbal in order to avoid cutting a hole in my firewall for the wiring harness.
If anybody is interested in a custom EFI system for a small block mopar with a F.A.S.T. EFI computer let me know ;).
What's the part # on the fast computer?
That's what I have sitting on my shelf is a Sniper EFI.
Get a Spectra EFI tank for the car, get the corvette fuel filter and a locked out distributor and you are good to go.
Awesome feedback, thanks guys. I am really sold on the sniper as well. Has anybody had issues with a shaker hood and using the bolt on throttle body?
Has anyone tried, looked into, the Holey Sniper Stealth? It may be too new yet. It's a lot more than a street car could use but was just wondering if anyone has tried it on something else. It's based on the 4500 Dominator. Supposed to be good from 800HP - 1500HP. I got a quote from Holley on a system matched to my configuration and it turned out to be $3800 not including all the good options.
If I were making more than 600 hp, I would be going to port injection instead of tbi. I have not dug into the Holley enuf to know if pfi is an option, or not.
I'm in the process of doing the Holley HP setup with dual TB's under a shaker. Using port injection, its considerably more work than the TB injection but the diriveablity, potential for tuning with add- ons in the future, is worth it IMHO.
I know someone here in New Zealand that put a Fast system on his big block pontiac. Spent hours on the phone to Fast and sent parts back twice and still had problems.He is a mechanic. That put me off. And the workshop dynoing my car has a 572 Hemi Roadrunner with twin Fitech TBI they are having trouble tuning. Apparently they are hard to overide the self learning and the RR has a 750 lift cam so no vacuum at idle. Also very hard to start. He should have used a big dominator carb or a proper aftermarket computer and multi point injection.
The TBI still has some of the disadvantages of a carb and aint cheap...
Neil listed his system above. I would probably use the Meqasquirt 3 to do one today as I have friends running them on Buicks with success in spite of all the words of doom put out by FAST tuners. I note several of them are suddenly installing them after claiming they would never work on a turbo buick.
Quote from: Mopsquad on May 18, 2018, 01:49:39 PM
I'm in the process of doing the Holley HP setup with dual TB's under a shaker. Using port injection, its considerably more work than the TB injection but the diriveablity, potential for tuning with add- ons in the future, is worth it IMHO.
That's just eye candy. Gorgeous motor and neat engine bay.
Quote from: Strawdawg on May 18, 2018, 01:46:03 PM
If I were making more than 600 hp, I would be going to port injection instead of tbi. I have not dug into the Holley enuf to know if pfi is an option, or not.
I agree, but the Charger hood will not allow enough clearance for any port injection set up that I've found.
Quote from: Brads70 on May 18, 2018, 11:51:53 AM
Quote from: ledphoot on May 18, 2018, 08:27:49 AM
That is correct. Sorry I was not more specific but that is my understanding.
BTW - I have the complete Holley Sniper System and their distributor on my bench and my brother has the MSD Atomic system.
I decided to go with this setup rather than the custom setup I got from Rich Nedbal in order to avoid cutting a hole in my firewall for the wiring harness.
If anybody is interested in a custom EFI system for a small block mopar with a F.A.S.T. EFI computer let me know ;).
What's the part # on the fast computer?
30-DCL-ECU
I installed the Holley Sniper setup late last summer with a stock points distributor on my 383. Yes, points. It was a huge improvement over the carb but still had some minor cold start idle quality issues. Honestly I may have been able to sort them out with some tuning but I didn't even try. I probably put 5-600 miles on it with points. I used the Sniper tank (Tanks Inc) and an Aeromotive 11540 fuel pump inside.
This spring I sprung for the Holley Dual Sync. Holy cow I should have done it last summer. The engine idles beautifully, starts instantly, runs tip top all the way through the rpm curve. The ability to dial in 2 degrees of timing at a certain rpm range simply with a few finger clicks is great. I have about 300 miles on the it now with the distributor and I look forward to turning the key every time.]
I would strongly recommend the Holley Sniper EFI setup. I mainly chose it over the FiTech because of the availability of the distributor. It truly is almost plug and play. Everything is very well labeled to boot.
Edit: I initially installed it with the wiring harness that was on the car and made a small jumper with a diode at the ballast resistor for the pink keyed ignition wire. Worked well. When I recently installed the Dual Sync distributor I also purchased a new replacement harness for points from M&H and modified that. There is very little to change but it was nice to clean up the wiring and firewall (remove the resistor) while I was at it. Even if wiring isn't your thing don't fret the Sniper setup (and I'll assume like units too) really are easy to install.
One other thing to note is my old stock alternator could not keep up with the electric pump and EFI demands. I was draining the battery. Maybe a fresh new unit would but rather than risk it I used a Denso unit from a 4cyl 4Runner, with the AREngineering brackets, fuse, and a new 4 ga charge wire eliminating the ammeter.
My son has been running a Sniper on this for about 2 years. Not a bit of trouble, I installed a Fitech on a car and we couldn't run the MSD through it like you are supposed to and the owner had trouble with it later, that was on a street car. I would do the Sniper. I also believe in the future parts availability will probably be best with the Sniper.
Sorry after having been screwed by Holley on an early EFI system I'm not going give them a second shot.... I think what really pissed me off was how every magazine raved about what a great system it was.... Advertising $$$ vs integrity guess which wins every time? I don't feel bad seeing lots of car magazines going belly up either.... :banana:
I love the twin T bodies on the Hemi , cannot wait until this runs , should be awesome !!
I agree with Wild that the first Holley EFI system were garbage , reluctant to try again as we did not get much support in the past unfortunatley
If any of you guys has any issues with fuel injection, contact Rich Nedbal @ http://www.fastmanefi.com
He is THE MAN in EFI, one of the smartest guys I have ever met.
Quote from: ledphoot on May 19, 2018, 12:19:59 AM
If any of you guys has any issues with fuel injection, contact Rich Nedbal @ http://www.fastmanefi.com
He is THE MAN in EFI, one of the smartest guys I have ever met.
I agree, IF I make the switch I'll be buying everything through him.
You bet, Rich is the go to guy alright. For a cheap store bought system though the others will work. This looked pretty enough but it had to be sent back once.
This will not fit under a Charger Hood ?
I bet a Holley street dom could be drilled & fit with a Accfab T body too
Quote from: Chryco Psycho on May 19, 2018, 03:15:26 PM
This will not fit under a Charger Hood ?
I bet a Holley street dom could be drilled & fit with a Accfab T body too
Maybe, but the issue is the hood slopes downward toward the front on the Charger so any 'high' manifold will not fit. Even the proflo from Edelbrock with the throttle body on the front will not clear.
Street dom is very low , only !' over stock & the accufab T body is only 1 .75 " tall , approx 1/2 the height of the carb so you should be 3/4" or more lower
I am trying to decide between Holley and FiTech at the moment... leaning toward the Holley Sniper.
I do plan to use an in-tank pump on a new tank (mine needs to be replaced anyway).
What is everyone using for the return lines? Does anyone have pics of the lines back to the tank?
Just run them beside your fuel line. Some guys run 3/8 back I think 5/16 is lots.
@runcharger, it looks like the kit includes high-pressure hose. Are you using that or running a second stainless line?
I appreciate the help!
FWIW I used two new pre-bent lines & modified both of them... They both turn and go up the firewall behind the engine, I used compression couplers to convert from steel to rubber hose mid way up the firewall to the back of the throttle body... In the rear I cut the return about mid way & again used a compression fitting to convert to hose over to the return on the tank & the pressure side has a rubber hose to the filter & from the filter to the steel line....
Just to throw this in the mix. I am running a Fast EZ EFI controller with port injection. I drilled and welded bungs in a Holley Street Dominator manifold and used Edelbrock fuel rails with a Fast throttle body and dual sink dizzy. Starts and runs great still a little fussy on acceleration when it is cold, but warmed up it runs great. :burnout:
Quote from: compugod on October 01, 2018, 06:51:49 AM
What is everyone using for the return lines? Does anyone have pics of the lines back to the tank?
I'm running efi braded lines for the main and return on the Sniper in my Charger. I didn't want to take the chance of any fuel delivery issues.
I ran braided line on the Cuda I setup as well. I probably would have done something different if it was my car but that is what the car owner wanted and it was easy to do.