E-Bodies.org Cuda Challenger Forum

Technical Shop => Engine, Transmission & Rear End => Topic started by: kawahonda on September 21, 2018, 07:44:12 PM

Title: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: kawahonda on September 21, 2018, 07:44:12 PM
I have a steady dripping coolant leak. About 1 cup every two weeks. It's enough to want to fix, for sure.

It's definitely coming from the driver's side.

It's definitely dripping from the bellhousing (first photo).

It's definitely dripping from the driver's side rear oil pan bolts (second photo).

It is definitely NOT dripping from any visible freeze plugs.

The exhaust manifold rear studs feel dry. It is most likely NOT dripping from those.

If you look in the engine bay, you will see the bottom of the block on the driver's side lime green, so it's hitting, or perhaps forming around there.

I cannot see any more of my dye from my intake nor from my heads, so I'm still at a loss on where this is coming from. I've used rotatable mirrors and I've gotten under the car and checked above the car from all angles.

Cracked block?



Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: GoodysGotaCuda on September 21, 2018, 07:46:31 PM
I'd start with, what engine?

Second, I suggest renting a pressure tester and pumping it up, it should expedite the leaking process for you and you can poke around easier on a cold engine.
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: kawahonda on September 21, 2018, 07:48:54 PM
Engine doesn't need to be hot nor cold. This is from 2 weeks of it parked with dye...steady drip every 5-10 minutes.

340.

I've probably spent 2-3 hours of the course of a month or two looking.

I know of a really good shop that can find leaks way faster than me. I suck at finding leaks. I'm just wondering what you guys think based on the images. It's really easy to say "must be coming from heads or intake", but I'd like visible proof before assuming that.
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: EV2RTSE on September 21, 2018, 07:53:34 PM
Probably a rusted out freeze plug in the back of the block, I had one fail on an unrestored '73 340 car about a year ago. I pulled the engine and replaced all of them. PITA. Note the weep hole below the plug, see if the coolant is coming from there on yours.




Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: kawahonda on September 21, 2018, 07:55:47 PM
Ah $hit.....there's a plug back there that I cannot see!?

I bet that's it, but I will say that my car is "relatively" rust free....
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: Cuda Cody on September 21, 2018, 07:56:29 PM
Pressure test it.  :bigthumb:
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: kawahonda on September 21, 2018, 07:57:41 PM
Sounds like I need to take it into my shop for a pressure test to identify it.

God I hope it's not that rear freeze plug.
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: Chryco Psycho on September 21, 2018, 08:04:22 PM
my guess is exhaust stud , it would dry when hot & only drip when cool / sitting
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: kawahonda on September 21, 2018, 08:04:50 PM
Just got under the car and looked (again).

Luckily I arrived at the right time and I saw what is going on. It is not coming through the weep hole, but it is certainly coming from behind that area, running down the back face of the block behind the weep hole where it hits the oil pan, then drips on the bellhousing.

I think that means freeze plug.

That means pulling engine.

Or that means dropping transmission.

Now it's time to consider options.

1) Pull engine and do a full rebuild.

2) Pull engine and replace the plug

3) Drop transmission and replace the plug

4) Deal with the leak for a year (ignore it).

I think what I will do is 4), and then 1).
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: EV2RTSE on September 21, 2018, 08:16:15 PM
Yeah there's another plug on the right rear side so it could be that one then. It's probably best to pull the engine and replace all of them, there are I forget exactly but like at least 10 or 12 in all in the block and heads, if one is bad then it's likely that there are others that are not far behind. If the engine is otherwise ok you could just pull it and replace the freeze plugs, the whole set is cheap so the only thing lost is the time spent pulling the engine & putting it back. But yeah if it's close to needing a rebuild then...

I don't think I'd run it much longer as is, if the plug totally fails you could lose all your coolant in a hurry.
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: kawahonda on September 21, 2018, 08:21:31 PM
Another option...Barr's Leak stop....

Will it crud up my radiator, heater core, or my water pump?

Engine doesn't "need" a rebuild. Runs, drives, and starts awesome. If you're going through the effort of pulling the engine, I'd certainly want to do more than just replace the freeze plugs. That's a big job. Not something I was planning to do any time soon.
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: RUNCHARGER on September 21, 2018, 08:57:53 PM
If ones leaking the rest are close to leaking.
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: BIGSHCLUNK on September 21, 2018, 09:07:41 PM
years ago I had the dreaded back of block leak on a SB...   not a rusty block either.... had to drop the trans
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: Rich G. on September 22, 2018, 07:23:27 AM
It's a lot easier to pull the trans and replace the ones in the back then to pull the engine. Unless you plan on opening up that can of worms. Two schools of thought, rebuild it All and be done or if it ain't broke don't fix it!
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: anlauto on September 22, 2018, 07:39:56 AM
I would try Barrs leak first...I don't think it plugs up everything else.
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: kawahonda on September 22, 2018, 08:22:51 AM
Which version of Barr's do you guys recommend for something like this? There's the tablets, the silver can, the red can, and the copper one (which sounds extreme).

Here's two popular options. Perhaps this first:

Liquid aluminum: https://www.autozone.com/miscellaneous-cleaners-and-degreasers/stop-leak/bar-s-liquid-aluminum-cooling-system-and-radiator-stop-leak/558353_0_0

Concentrate: https://www.autozone.com/miscellaneous-cleaners-and-degreasers/stop-leak/bar-s-cooling-system-stop-leak/426115_0_0

Certainly worth a shot if it doesn't crud anything and buys me a couple years. It has been known to solve plug leaks like these....
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: Chryco Psycho on September 22, 2018, 09:10:04 AM
http://www.irontite.com/
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: RUNCHARGER on September 22, 2018, 09:15:13 AM
I wonder if a guy could use barrs leak on rusted quarter panels?
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: kawahonda on September 22, 2018, 10:56:54 AM
I'll pick up some iron tite on the way home.
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: kawahonda on September 22, 2018, 11:08:40 AM
Crycho,red or blue bottle?
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: kawahonda on September 22, 2018, 12:28:21 PM
No need to answer. I went with Bars, just the basic formula because I didn't trust using the kind with big flakes.

Engine is running with it now. I'll report back over the next few days to see if it worked. Hopefully will buy me a year or so.
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: Chryco Psycho on September 22, 2018, 12:55:25 PM
I have had amazing results with Irontite if Bars doesn't help
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: Brads70 on September 22, 2018, 02:04:50 PM
Quote from: Chryco Psycho on September 22, 2018, 12:55:25 PM
I have had amazing results with Irontite if Bars doesn't help

Yep me too!  :iagree:
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: Moprr on September 22, 2018, 03:27:42 PM
I used iron tite in the wife's car for the head gasket leak and it worked for a few years.  NOt sure but I have been told by some that some Honda dealers used it when vehicles were under warranty.
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: Chryco Psycho on September 22, 2018, 04:13:51 PM
I heard Cadillac used it as the Northstar castings were often porous even on the assembly line
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: 71-440 on September 22, 2018, 05:34:36 PM
Never heard of Irontite. Used Barrs leak way back in the day with some success.
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: kawahonda on September 22, 2018, 07:25:44 PM
Does coolant go in our heater core even when the heater switch is off? Just curious.
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: 1 Wild R/T on September 23, 2018, 12:53:25 AM
Quote from: kawahonda on September 22, 2018, 07:25:44 PM
Does coolant go in our heater core even when the heater switch is off? Just curious.

Yes... Especially true of a non-A/C car.... Does your windshield fog up?
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: kawahonda on September 23, 2018, 09:14:40 AM
Nope, windshield doesn't fog up at all.

Well, Bar's didn't work. I had it idle twice for 30 minutes.

I suppose I'll flush it and try irontite. I should certainly use the flush bottle, but @Chryco Psycho (https://forum.e-bodies.org/mlist/chryco-psycho_4) , do you use blue and red, or just one of them?
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: Chryco Psycho on September 23, 2018, 11:26:52 AM
I have only seen or used 1 type of Irontite in a grey bottle , the different colors may be for different applications or metal types
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: kawahonda on September 23, 2018, 11:48:49 AM
Hmmm, it seems like Irontite only sells the colored bottles now.

Green: Flush. I'll certainly get this one.

Blue: "All weather" seal:
Pour and Go - into your existing coolant mixture
Stays dissolved and suspended now and long into the future.
Stops Leaks in Radiators, Head Gaskets, Cylinder Heads, and Engine Blocks
Works in Gas or Diesel Engines
Works in Aluminium and Cast Iron Blocks and on hoses and any other kind of material.

Red: Ceramic seal, "Coats to Fill Cracks and Porousness. Prevents Rust, Corrosion and Leaks"

I think the idea is to flush and drain the system (green bottle). Then fill up cooling system part ways with water and add the red bottle. Run the engine for a very short period of time. Drain it again. Then, fill it up with coolant and add the "blue" bottle.

Seems to me that the "red" bottle is doing all the work, and the blue bottle is essentially just maintainance.

I'll buy the kit (which is all three) and give this a shot.

Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: CudaMoparRay on September 23, 2018, 12:33:54 PM
Wishing you the best of luck but with all those confusing multiple colored bottles it is enough for me to "Go Hit the Bottle'   :drunk:
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: RUNCHARGER on September 23, 2018, 01:12:06 PM
I still don't see the one that repairs sheetmetal. I can see the stuff working on headgaskets alright though.
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: kawahonda on September 26, 2018, 08:19:14 PM
Metal is porous, so yes, it may work.

I'm about done with Step 1, which is just using the green bottle and flushing the shit out of it. I made the mistake of starting at 6PM. It's now 9, and I'm still flushing it. Doing a good flush takes a long time.

My guess is that the green bottle is basically phosphoric acid and cleaners and degreasers. I already ran that through. This probably leaves an etching, similar to vinegar.

Now it's getting absolutely all color out and that takes awhile.

Next step is the ceramic seal. This is probably the magic ticket for me.  Your supposed to only use this stuff with distilled water. Run for 1 hour or drive for two days. I'll probably idle with it to full operating temp several times over the next few days since I'm still waiting on my damn seats.

Once that's done it's time to flush again, and refill with coolant and the third bottle, which is probably similar to Bars, but probably better.

$50 for the set. Question is, will it work and tide me over from needing to pull engine for another year. That's money well spent. Did it do anything? If not, then money not well spent.

Fingers crossed. All is well so far. Heater blows nice and hot during and after the flushing.
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: kawahonda on September 26, 2018, 10:54:56 PM
It's midnight, and I'm now rocking step 2.

In the process, I replaced the upper radiator hose screw-clamps with some proper stock pinch clamps.

Got 99.5% of all the coolant out. Definitely the Bar's treatment is gone by now. Put in the ceramic seal bottle and distilled water. Got it to operating temps. Pulled it outside and left it running and cleaned out the work area and got it dry and put a pan out.

Hopefully in the next day or two I will be able to post some feedback. If step 2 doesn't at least solve the minor leak then I have doubts about step 3 doing much.

So far, so good. I was getting some water pump noise after the flush treament, but it vanished in a few minutes after some good cycling.

Not much else to say, other than it took me forever to fully flush the coolant out. I had some green dye in there previously, so I wasn't sure if I was looking at residual dye or coolant. I pretty much got everything out regardless, though.



Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: Chryco Psycho on September 27, 2018, 02:15:22 PM
 :pixiepop:
Title: Re: Where is my coolant leak?
Post by: kawahonda on September 27, 2018, 07:35:02 PM
Chryco is super excited to see what the results are!

I did a 25 minute, and a 50 minute heat cycle this evening.

Heater still blowing nice and hot. No fogging or anything. The product obviously does not cause any harm if you follow the instructions.

I'll repeat what I did today tomorrow, and begin the flush either tomorrow night or Saturday morning.

Zerex G-05 is pretty much what to use for these cars? Probably will do a 50/50 mix w/ distilled water.