Back in 2014, Hemming's ran an article on Sam Posey's T/A Challenger #76. The article shows pictures of the T/A. The Keith Black engine's single 4 bbl carb air cleaner does not have a base plate that seals against the T/A hood. The carb has a conventional open air cleaner system with chrome lid. Did his racing team find this produced better results than the base plate sealed against the hood scoop? :clueless:
I've seen vintage pictures that show an isolated air filter, so I'd say this is just for simplicity sake now that wringing ever last possible pony out of it is not required.
did you ever try to find one of these? :huh:
That's only one piece to the puzzle. Part two, the hood plate, is needed to complete the package. I have found both pieces to be like trying to find a distant place located beyond the "borders of the known world."
That K&N really looks bad on there.
The air cleaner looks worse than bad... it is fugly! Spectre makes a better 14" air cleaner in a pan with different filter heights. See pic. With a T/A hood-under-scoop plate it could be functional. I've given it some thought because my Challenger has factory a/c and the original 1970 six-pak T/A base plate will bump into it.
Are we talking race or stock set ups here? The TA and AAR race efforts did not use factory parts for scoop isolation. They used simple pans and seals. The factory used pieces that allowed air flow while retaining cold start heating and allowed for the evacuation of water that might be encountered on the street. These were extensively engineered pieces that were produced in minimal numbers and abused and thrown away often making them pretty rare.
As to why the current iteration of the #76 uses a non isolated system, you'd probably have to ask the current owner why they do that.
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Ahh: That looks way better!
The Hemming's article states John Miller developed the V-8s for Gurney's AARs and Keith Black built the V8s for Posey's T/As. So one would be comparing apples to oranges when making comparisons of the two.
I see.
So what I don't see is an original picture of a posey motor circa 1970.
Anyone have a pic? or two?
I like your plausible explanation. The Hemmings Daily article dated Nov 10th, 2014, is titled "One of two Sam Posey-driven Trans-Am 1970 Dodge Challengers heads to auction."
here's a couple engine pics from the '70 Trans Am season
Bridgehampton, NY (Marlboro 200) June 21, 1970
Sam POSEY Challenger DNF 20th
Gerald ROBINSON Barracuda DNF 21st
Swede SAVAGE Barracuda DNF 22nd
Watkins Glen, NY August 16, 1970
Swede SAVAGE Barracuda 6th
Sam POSEY Challenger DNF 29th
Both the dodge and the plymouth top plates look very different than the one Ironman pictured.
The ironman one looks to have been made by factory due to the provisions on both sides (squarish cutouts), it has a rounded inner that points up towards the hood.
Whereas the other ones appear to come straight down 90* from the top plate. They also look to be riveted far less than the ironman one.
Also, it appears that the t/a top plate is larger than the aar top plate.
So how many of those top plates would have been produced over the period of the t/a and aar?
Great shots 6bbl. Race cars evolved, sometimes if they fabbed 6 air cleaners each one may have been different.
I sure would like to know what 3577458 looks like :brainiac:
This thread with it's pictures and comments got me wondering....why substitute three-two-barrels for a single four-barrel? So, I looked in the SCCA 1970 Edition Rule Book and found this:
Yes: The 6bbl setup was a sales gimmick I suppose but we're all glad they did it.
I believe the '67-68-69 SCCA T/A rules allowed multi-carbs (cross-rams were common on GMs and some AMCs, in-line carbs for the Fords, etc), so the six-bbl was Mopar's intro... logic?... to go along with the BB engines at the time??
The vintage SCCA T/A series is still my all-time favorite! Love watching the cars run in last few years up at Road America (Elkhart Lk, WI).
True. I recall seeing a low profile cross ram with dual quads for the original Z28 302 engine program. I don't doubt SCCA went to the single four rule for simplicity of enforcement and cost containment for teams. IIRC, they weren't particularly fond of the big time Detriot factory efforts dumping cubic dollars into their sports car programs.
Quote from: HP2 on December 13, 2017, 07:54:09 AM
they weren't particularly fond of the big time Detriot factory efforts dumping cubic dollars into their sports car programs.
I bet they would kill to have that now.....
I dunno. They still fancy themselves as an every man racing entity. Their Pro efforts are still all relatively low key.