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Offline ricomondo

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**BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« on: January 13, 2020, 03:01:40 PM »
Seller on ebay selling COMPLETE numbers for an EB5 AAR Cuda:
*title
*cut out cowl with numbers
* Both fender tags
* complete rad support
*Dash pad with VIN tag

He has the last 6 covered, but appears to be all legit as far as numbers go.
This has the making of a fraudulent  reappearance of this AAR down the road as a re body.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/70-AAR-Cuda-4-Speed-Dash-Parts-only-No-Body-Will-Ship-Via-Greyhound-Bus-Termina/163608555652?hash=item2617d47084:g:qo4AAOSw9A5ck5bH


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Offline JS29

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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2020, 03:27:56 PM »
 :foul: appears to from a rust bucket of an AAR.  :Stirring: The guy was more than likely planed on doing a re-body himself, and now figures he will aide someone else in a fraud.  :alan2cents:   

Offline 6Pack70

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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2020, 03:44:41 PM »
I don't consider rebodying a fraud if no factory issued numbers are tampered with, modified or changed in any way.  It's been 50 years.  This comes up all the time.  Cars rot out or get crashed and need new metal.  To me, stamping blocks and transmissions, cowles and core supports to make your car (which might be missing some of these factory numbers) is a crime and has intent to mislead people.   You might be shocked to hear how many restored muscle cars (including dozens of high profile Mopars) are nearly all AMD or new bodied or a mix of both.   If I were to purchase a Mopar and I found out the donar unibody structure was a clean 318 car structure but was done correctly and the numbers on it are from a real deal rare machine that did actually exist,.... and the seller made me aware of this....it really wouldn't bother me. 

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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2020, 03:44:41 PM »

Offline 6Pack70

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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2020, 04:19:18 PM »
I know and have photos of the full vin and tags for that AAR.  At least it really did exist.  I really do think there should be a place where Mopars that are re-born from real cars that were ruined can be accepted.  Especially with all the reproduction metal available to bring these cars back.  Geez.... before you know it, everyone that puts there cowl and core support numbers back on their replacement AMD panels because of rot or an accident will be considered trying to fool somebody or scam someone.   50 years now people.  Its just metal.... relax.  If you know what you're looking at, you'll know if someone is trying to screw you. Ask questions, seek professional asssistance if you're not sure.  Changed and tampered with numbers and codes are more important to me.  Fake buildsheets and tags... that is fraud.  New metal to replace wasted stuff but numbers 100% legit..... ok in my book.   You know what they say about opinions though.   Hope my feelings on this topic don't upset people.... it's not meant to.
And no, I do not know the seller of those AAR tags.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2020, 04:36:39 PM by 6Pack70 »

Offline Marty

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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2020, 05:19:51 PM »
I see your point. Tough call though.

Offline Plumcrazzy

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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2020, 05:37:44 PM »
Could it be that folks who get upset about "rebodied" cars are the same folks who were fortunate enough to have found an original car with documentation? Deceit is one thing but sheet metal from AMD or a donor car used to put another MOPAR back on the road is not being dishonest unless the seller intends to pass the vehicle off as a more rare version. Would you change the stampings, VIN # on a 440 Six-Pack R/T to represent a 318, column shifted automatic? Nah.

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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2020, 05:39:17 PM »
I really do think there should be a place where Mopars that are re-born from real cars that were ruined can be accepted.  Especially with all the reproduction metal available to bring these cars back.  Geez.... before you know it, everyone that puts there cowl and core support numbers back on their replacement AMD panels because of rot or an accident will be considered trying to fool somebody or scam someone.   50 years now people.  Its just metal.... relax.  If you know what you're looking at, you'll know if someone is trying to screw you. Ask questions, seek professional asssistance if you're not sure.  Changed and tampered with numbers and codes are more important to me.  Fake buildsheets and tags... that is fraud.  New metal to replace wasted stuff but numbers 100% legit..... ok in my book.   

I agree with 6pack70 100%. At least this AAR exists, it can be rebuilt.

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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2020, 05:39:17 PM »

Offline 6Pack70

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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2020, 06:32:10 PM »
Could it be that folks who get upset about "rebodied" cars are the same folks who were fortunate enough to have found an original car with documentation? Deceit is one thing but sheet metal from AMD or a donor car used to put another MOPAR back on the road is not being dishonest unless the seller intends to pass the vehicle off as a more rare version. Would you change the stampings, VIN # on a 440 Six-Pack R/T to represent a 318, column shifted automatic? Nah.

I agree and I'm sure guys who posess original metal, highly documented examples of rare Mopars might think that a car using a donor body to rebuild it from complete rot out, might cut into the value of their cars.  A donar unibody structure does not always get used to take a shortcut in a restoration, it might just be absolutely necessary to complete the task.  A car requiring this type of work to complete should stand proud...but in a completely different class than a true original metal, never rusted or wrecked car.  It should be priced accordingly.  I would always, pay a premium for an unmolested car that had a great restoration not needing every single piece of steel on it.  Not for a car that has all new metal and or the use of a donor unibody.  I do believe these cars should have a place in our hobby thpugh.... as long as their numbers have not been modified in any way.    Say you have a very rare and desirable Mopar that is completely numbers matching including engine, trans... with buildsheets, fender tags and all the correct original body stampings, but it was in a bad fire, or it sat and rotted out every pan, frame rail, cowl everything....just a real POS.... but all there.  Is it a felony or are you a crook for calling AMD and ordering everything they make to build it's body into a safe roadworthy and enjoyable machine again.  Me personally.... I dont think so.  As long as those numbers are not changed.

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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2020, 07:09:02 PM »
I know and have photos of the full vin and tags for that AAR.  At least it really did exist.

Well, we sure would like to see them.   :popcorn:
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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2020, 07:16:49 PM »
WOW...this is my dream car, a blue on blue four speed AAR....might have a little problem importing it into Canada though... :crying: :haha:

I'm with 6Pack70 ...it's worth bringing this one back.... :twothumbsup:
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Offline 6Pack70

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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #10 on: January 13, 2020, 07:27:56 PM »
The order number is not covered on the vin tag. When these items were listed the very first time, I right clicked and saved the vin number to my home computer. Then, like many people do, he covered the last six for privacy.   So I dont get phonecalls from some guy screaming I violated his privacy, I'm gonna choose to not post the full vin for now.  I think if he was smart he would let people know the full vin, but that's  his decision not mine.  I still think his price is a bit high even for a cool AAR like that.

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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #10 on: January 13, 2020, 07:27:56 PM »

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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #11 on: January 13, 2020, 07:34:28 PM »
Too bad he doesn't have the engine and transmission.

Offline ricomondo

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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #12 on: January 13, 2020, 08:05:00 PM »
The issue here which has been addressed ad nauseam is that when you remove the dash VIN and replace it onto another vehicle from which it was not born with, that is illegal. Plain and simple. I don't wish to argue this fact, just stating what it is; fact.
That's exactly what may happen with these parts and paperwork, as unless the seller has the rest of the body to restore; which I doubt as the cowl numbers and rad support have been cut off, these AAR specific pieces will find their way onto another Barracauda/Cuda body and be passed off to someone not in the know.

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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #13 on: January 13, 2020, 08:11:01 PM »
I think I’d feel more than a little uneasy buying just some numbers for an AAR from some guy on ebay, but I do also agree with 6Pack70 and think what he said is pretty spot-on regarding rebodies.  As long as you’re not creating something that wasn’t already there in the first place.   


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Offline 6Pack70

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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #14 on: January 13, 2020, 09:05:39 PM »
The issue here which has been addressed ad nauseam is that when you remove the dash VIN and replace it onto another vehicle from which it was not born with, that is illegal. Plain and simple. I don't wish to argue this fact, just stating what it is; fact.
That's exactly what may happen with these parts and paperwork, as unless the seller has the rest of the body to restore; which I doubt as the cowl numbers and rad support have been cut off, these AAR specific pieces will find their way onto another Barracauda/Cuda body and be passed off to someone not in the know.
8
Please trust me when I say I do not wish to argue the point either and I do see the plain and simple also. However, technically,  the very second that any enthusiast touches those vin rivets on that dash plate, you are doing something illegal.  With that said, do you know how many Mopar guys that absolutely love their cars should also have criminal records right now?  Rivets and dry transfer decals are being sold legally to restore your dash's vin tag but in order to perform a tag restoration correctly, you need to commit a crime by grinding the old original rivets off from the bottom.  In my opinion,  there are far more enthusiasts trying to restore for their own pleasure than scumbags trying to pull a fast one and the restoration market caters to the restorer and trys to help.  Yes, its unfortunate that people will try tp scam you everywhere in every aspect of your life.  People know when to hang up the phone when Nigeria is calling.  When placing an order with AMD, should I stop at some point and not order too much replacement metal because I might be going to far. My project might be considered a rebody and if I reinstall my dash with vin plate into that long list of metal, I'm committing a crime?   If yes, I'll say it again, alot of musclecar enthusiasts should be in jail for making their dream cars live again.   This topic will always be a glass half empty deal until people consider New Bodied musclecars sort of a class of their own. Still valuable.... but not nearly as valuable as a true documented original bodied car.

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Re: **BEWARE** COMPLETE AAR Cuda numbers, title etc for sale
« Reply #14 on: January 13, 2020, 09:05:39 PM »

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