440 Cam Install and Timing

[rebelyell]

Finally got everything buttoned up on a cam install last night. Tried to start it, but the timing isn't right. I'm sure I followed the steps correctly, but I don't know enough about it to know why it won't start.

Starting with the cam install, I lined up the zero mark on the crank sprocket with the timing mark on the cam gear. Bolted it in and installed everything else. Fairly foolproof, right?

I think the issue is in the distributor. I used a piston stop to find TDC after everything was installed. Had to set the stop so that it *just* touched the piston in order for the mark on the harmonic balancer to come close to the timing cover. Rotated CW, marked the cover. Rotated CCW, marked the cover. Made a mark in between the two as my TDC mark.

Installed the distributor lower shaft, then the upper part. Rotated the distributor until the button pointed to the #1 spark plug wire so I figured everything was good and bolted everything down.

No start. What am I missing? Didn't crank more than about 8 seconds. Should it not start fairly quickly? My best guess is that where I set the engine wasn't exactly TDC and where I set the distributor wasn't exactly on #1 cylinder. How much tolerance do I get to set this correctly? I don't want to mess this up with a brand new cam.

[rebelyell]

I'll go ahead and say that this part " set the engine to 20* Before TDC on #1 cylinder firing stroke  & line up the reluctor & pickup tabs so you will have close to 18* timing as soon as you crank it . If you unplug the connector to the dist with the key on you can confirm spark , you will get 1 spark everytime you unplug it."

is what i'm missing.

Does this mean to manually rotate the engine 20 degrees (as read on the timing cover) before the TDC mark? Then line up the distributor so the button is as close as I can get it to the #1 wire?

[ratroaster]

Are you sure you are on TDC on the compression stroke? Your dizzy is probably off 180. You can determine if it is 180 out by removing #1 plug and placing your finger/thumb over the hole. (Temporarily remove the wire from the coil first) Have someone "tap" the starter and you will feel pressure trying to to blow your finger away. This is the compression stroke. 

[rebelyell]

I'm sure of this. Both valves were closed when I set TDC and I put the valve cover on. I'm also not getting any backfire through the carb.

[Chryco Psycho]

Normally on the timing gears  if the crank is at 12 oclock & the cam is at 6 oclock you are firing Cylinder #6 , it can look like the valves are both closed as you are in the middle of the overlap on the cam & hyd lifters will bleed down / need to be pumped up while running so my bet is you are 180 out on the dist cap

[rebelyell]

Yeah, I give up. Just going to take it somewhere.

[mopar jack]

did you prime the carb?

[Strawdawg]

Why are you giving up?  It may mean that all you have to do is reorder the distributor cap order.

Pull number one plug and turn the engine over with a breaker bar.  When air puffs out the plug hole, then you know you just hit TDC on number one cylinder.  Pull the distributor cap and see where the rotor is pointing.  If it is aimed where number 6 on the cap is located, then rotate the wires so that becomes number one instead of six.

I'm going to assume the carb has gas in it and shoots a stream when you open the butterflys and that you checked to be sure you had spark at the plug terminals when you crank the engine.

[RUNCHARGER]

Sorry: I just have to ask. You are aware that a BB distributor turns CCW? That obviously effects your firing order.

[Chryco Psycho]

Tooo far for a road trip unfortunatly or we would would have it running in 10 mins 

[rebelyell]

100% certain its getting spark and the carb is shooting fuel. It runs for a few turns and shuts off. After thinking about it all night, I think it's the fuel filter not flowing enough. I'm going to use the old filter and try again tonight.

I'm using a timing light as I'm starting it to get it as close to TDC as I can. I just feel like its burning all the fuel I pumped in there and stopping.

[rebelyell]

Tooo far for a road trip unfortunatly or we would would have it running in 10 mins 

I really do appreciate the sentiment. 

[Strawdawg]

in that case, maybe you should check to see if the + terminal on the coil has voltage when the key is in the RUN position.

When you crank the car over on the starter, the coil gets voltage via the cranking circuit.  Once started and you let the key go back to the run position, it takes a different route thru the ballast resistor in order to supply a lower voltage that will not fry the coil.  It's pretty common for the ballast resistor circuit to fail.

If you have a steady voltage on the plus terminal with the key in RUN, then that would seem to eliminate that possibility.  Note the voltage will be lower than battery due to the ballast.

The fuel side should be easy to check.  If the accelerator pump will still shoot a stream when it quits, it's probably not a fuel problem.

[rebelyell]

I'll have to check to be sure, but I'm almost certain that it is. I'm using a remote start switch so I can check the timing as it's being started. Wouldn't it not fire at all if the coil wasn't getting voltage?

Would the new cam require that I change the fuel pump pushrod? Could I possibly need a longer one or does it matter?

[Strawdawg]

I would like to think that you are right and using a remote starter would suggest that it is getting power to the coil in the RUN position, but, I would have to look at the diagrams to see if there was a reverse path to the coil when the remote starter was used...quicker to just check with a meter than for me to pull the books out. LOL

If the pump is not pushing enuf fuel to keep the carb filled, I would think it would not have enuf fuel in the bowl to get a good accelerator pump shot after it quit???

Normally, you should not need a pushrod unless the old one was worn down and is too short for a full stroke on the pump any more.    It does happen.  On a Holley style carb, you can jook in the sight hole and see if it has fuel in it....

If you have a fuel pressure gauge on it, you can watch the pressure and see if it is staying where it should be.

Or, as the engine starts to die, you can squirt some carb cleaner in the carb and see if that makes it want to keep going.