oil filter question

[chargerdon]

Prices on oil filters vary wildly...   From as low as $4.99 to about $20 for the High Performance Extended Life oil filters.    For many many years I always bought standard or premium Fram oil filters for my Mopars.    Recently there have been many people claiming that Fram filters are garbage and can even damage our expensive engines.   

I for one have never been the type believe that just because it costs more, it has to be better, or "you get what u pay for".   I have seen so many times where the more expensive part is not even as good as the cheap one or that more to the point "are wasted money overkill".    I had a 2006 Sebring convertible with 125,000 miles on it and the Tie Rods Ball Joints went bad.   My choices for replacements included an OEM equivalent for $25 each, or a MOOG engineered for lifetime better one for $48 each.  I chose the OEM equivalent for $25 as if the first lasted 125,000 miles and i didnt expect to keep it for more than another 50,000 then why waste the money?     I dont put 94 octane gas into my 87 octane needed daily driver either.     When i needed the windshield wiper motor replaced on my 74 Challenger i bought the WAI unit from Advance Auto for $60 rather than pay over $125 for the Carquest premium wiper.   After all if the original lasted nearly 50 years and the car rarely goes out in the rain, why would i need a premium.   So with that as a prelude...am i being stupid to buy a Fram or even worse STP brand of oil products and pocket the savings?   

I watched the youtube video on this and agree that the Fram isn't made as well as the Napa Gold or WIX brand of filters costing three times as much.   But then my question is "SO WHAT"!!!   Im 75 and have never experienced a filter failing !!   I ALWAYS ALWAYS change my filter when changing my Oil every 2,000 miles or Yearly on my 74 Challenger which gets driven about 1,500 miles or less, and when i take the filter off have never seen any signs of failure.   Several times i cut in half the used filter to examine for any signs of metal in the filter and i have NEVER seen the filter element falling apart.    Maybe if i did what they used to recommend of 5-7,000 miles between oil changes then an inferior paper element might be a worry, but, i cant see that being a problem with 2,000 mile changes or 5,000 on my daily driver.   

Opinions welcome...  I know that many of you will reply with "i only buy the best", but others ?

[Chryco Psycho]

 Fram used to be made by Federal Parts group , maybe 20 years ago it was sold to Honeywell [chinese] , I have witnessed engine damage with Fram filters & will never buy them now , they have far less & poorer quality filter media , JUNK .
When protecting a $6-10k + engine a few extra $$ here & there is nothing , having said that I don't buy the most expensive filter either so usually I use a WIX / Napa Gold , they were never 3x the price but I have not lived in North America for over 12 years now , Baldwin , Lubrifiner , K&N are all good filters also .
When building engines I Always used Forged piston for example , if there is a problem the gasket set to tear the engine down is more money than the difference in the piston price nevermind the cost of engine parts if there is damage , so I Never use Cast or Hyper pistons .

[JH27N0B]

I used to mostly use Frams and the only problem I ever had was once I went to install one and the threads were defective, so I had to hop in the other car and go buy another one to finish my oil change.
When I started seeing information on how poorly the internal valve and filter material is on Frams, at least their standard filters, I got scared off. I now usually use Wix and Napa, which are Wix made.
At least in the case of oil filters, it's not a case of "I only buy the best, money is no object", rather a case of the high rated oil filters are not very much money, so why take a chance?
It costs maybe $5 for a Fram, $10 for a NAPA. I don't recall ever seeing any much over $10 for cars let alone $20.  What can you buy now for $5?   Spending an extra $5 on a filter to be on the safe side 3 or 4 times a year doesn't affect my finances one iota so that one's a no brainer.
As for other components, that's a tough call. Lifetime warranties are nice, but the labor is the big factor. Reminds me of the old days when you'd get a lifetime warranty on your muffler but still run up a big bill every couple years when it got rusty and you'd go back to Midas for your free replacement, and pay for labor and other needed components to fix your exhaust!
I hear complaints online nowadays about problems with many car parts makers products.  Terms like OEM quality are meaningless.  Sometimes I think the only way to go is buying high priced parts at a dealer if you want long lasting results. Other than brake parts, fortunately I don't run into these issues often as my drivers don't break down much (knock wood) but I want the most reliable part if I am fixing something so I have less worries about having to deal with it again.
We had another thread recently about brake rotors going bad early.  I've run into that issue often, I'm tempted to try OEM rotors next time I do brakes to see if I get more miles out of a set of brakes.

[MoparLeo]

Have you tried Centric ?

[Katfish]

 SuperTech for me

[Chryco Psycho]

I believe the brake pad formula has changed a lot with Ceramic & other compounds , so the rotor life is shorter due to more abrasive materials .

[JH27N0B]

Have you tried Centric ?

In fact that's what I've been using on my Dart.  OE rear brakes were pretty ugly looking at 60,000 miles but still pad left.  The Centrics with their coated rotors I used for the first brake job with were completely shot with just under 50K on them.  Shrieking like a banshee on the right, rear pads worn to backing. Rotors looked like they'd been soaked in salt water for 40 years.
OE fronts went over 80K and still had some life in them, it looked like when I replaced.  Coated centric rotors still look good 3 years later 25-30K miles on them.
As previously mentioned, we had a thread on rear disc brakes getting shot quickly in rust belt areas.  I don't think we all came to a complete consensus but many agreed rear disc has corrosion problems in damp climates where the roads get salted in winter. Rear drums don't have this issue. If any parts manufacturers have got brakes that tolerate these conditions well, I'm all ears! I'd do a rear drum conversion if I could!

[Brads70]

My involvement in circle track racing has taught be a few things. First I avoid Fram oil filters like the plague. Numorous times I see long faces and the car being loaded up on the trailer , so I go over and ask whats up. If it was no oil pressure ( usually in practice) I'd look down and see that familiar "orange glow" and say go to the parts trailer and try a wix filter before you go home. Once with a seasoned veteran I even had to offer to buy the filter if it didn't work. He was so shocked when they fired up the car with the wix filter and had oil pressure again! This happened I'd say a couple times per season till the word got around. 

Second with brake rotors, I used to help out the racers by drilling out the stock rotors and installing 5/8 studs. I noticed a stark difference in the pressure required on the drill and the chips in the "white box, economy " rotors as compared to a brand name that back then was made in the USA . The USA brands never broke either but the china ones did when they got really hot , like glowing orange . 
You can put all the fancy coating on a rotor you want to prevent rust but if it's not good material to start with they will wear different. Ironically if you start with good material rust will be less also even without coatings

[JH27N0B]

Problem is I don't know who if anyone makes brake parts in North America anymore.
I was an engineer at the company that made Raybestos and NAPA United until getting laid off in 2005.
They were shutting down all the domestic factories then and moving it overseas.
Around 2000 new brake rotors started arriving from China for less than we spent just for a casting before machining and packaging. Sales tried to emphasize our quality and made in USA parts, but in the end most people just go for lowest price, and they finally had to go with Chinese product too in order to stay competitive.

[bdschnei]

Are Fram oil filters really junk as many claim? Maybe, but... Over that last 20+ years I've had two Neons that I've put on over 1 million miles between the two, a Stratus/Sebring pair that probably had 400K miles, and a couple of pickups that had another 300K miles between them. Plus a few other miscellaneous vehicles with another 200K or so between them. All with Fram filters and QS oil. I did all the maintenance myself. So roughly 2 million miles later how much did I spend on internal engine repairs? Exactly $0.00. I'm sticking with Fram.

[chargerdon]

My involvement in circle track racing has taught be a few things. First I avoid Fram oil filters like the plague. Numorous times I see long faces and the car being loaded up on the trailer , so I go over and ask whats up. If it was no oil pressure ( usually in practice) I'd look down and see that familiar "orange glow" and say go to the parts trailer and try a wix filter before you go home. Once with a seasoned veteran I even had to offer to buy the filter if it didn't work. He was so shocked when they fired up the car with the wix filter and had oil pressure again! This happened I'd say a couple times per season till the word got around. 

Ive NEVER seen any engine have zero oil pressure because of the oil filter.   In fact I do not even understand how that would be possible... the oil filter isn't the only passageway in the engine so even if totally plugged there would still be pressure, in fact if totally plugged there would be more pressure as that would be one less oil path...if the bypass valve got stuck open it would reduce the pressure but there would still be some.   About the only way i can think of would be if the filter element disintegrated and plugged up the pick up tube screen.   But, if that were the case then changing the filter would not unclog it.   I do not understand how that would be even possible.   

[Brads70]

My involvement in circle track racing has taught be a few things. First I avoid Fram oil filters like the plague. Numorous times I see long faces and the car being loaded up on the trailer , so I go over and ask whats up. If it was no oil pressure ( usually in practice) I'd look down and see that familiar "orange glow" and say go to the parts trailer and try a wix filter before you go home. Once with a seasoned veteran I even had to offer to buy the filter if it didn't work. He was so shocked when they fired up the car with the wix filter and had oil pressure again! This happened I'd say a couple times per season till the word got around. 

Ive NEVER seen any engine have zero oil pressure because of the oil filter.   In fact I do not even understand how that would be possible... the oil filter isn't the only passageway in the engine so even if totally plugged there would still be pressure, in fact if totally plugged there would be more pressure as that would be one less oil path...if the bypass valve got stuck open it would reduce the pressure but there would still be some.   About the only way i can think of would be if the filter element disintegrated and plugged up the pick up tube screen.   But, if that were the case then changing the filter would not unclog it.   I do not understand how that would be even possible.   

Race engines do not use the bypass, they are plugged on purpose forcing all the oil to go thru the filter, so if it collapses ....

[RUNCHARGER]

I use Wix or Baldwin. I think if you have a 200,000 mile 318 that you hate, a Fram is okay but why not pay an extra $1 and get something better. There has been enough documentation I've seen over the last 20 years to show that Fram is inferior. As a matter of fact if I'm buying a used vehicle and I see a Fram on it, that usually stops me from pursuing purchasing the vehicle. The oil filter is not a good place to skimp on the maintenance of your car.

[MoparLeo]

Have experienced bad oil filters restricting flow on Chevrolets back in the 70's.

Composite brake rotors have different materials in the friction section of the rotor as opposed to the center where you drill the bolt circle.
First posting mentioning short rotor life did not mention that it was a rear disc conversion and premature inside wear is not the rotors fault. It is/can be a combination of caliper not sliding on the pins/ramp depending on year of caliper/bracket set. Or piston sticking and not retracting.
And the difference between a caliper with a piston on the inside only as opposed to inner and out pistons where the caliper is non moving.
Most times single piston caliper pads are thicker on the inner pad to help compensate for unequal clamping force with only one side moving.Seen mostly on GM brake pads.

[Dmod1974]

Personally, I don't think it matters what you run on old school street engines like a 318.  I've ran STP, FRAM at times, WIX, Bosch, pretty much all of them daily drivers and beaters.

FRAM would be out of business or the brand name dropped if they were as bad as their reputation sounds.  I have no doubt they've had issues in the distant past that earned that, but I'd bet they are no better or worse than any other filter manufacturer at this point.  They have more than just the old orange can in their line up; they have extended life and HP filters as well.  Most everything is different between them too (filter media, can, bypass valving), so lumping them all together really doesn't make sense.

Some modern engines get a little finicky with aftermarket oil filters in general, and diesel engine can definitely have major problems with non OEM fuel filters, but I don't think it matters with your car and your application.  For newer stuff, I usually just stick with OEM.  The price point is usually the same, and I know it'll work ok.  Not saying the quality is necessarily any better (some OEM stuff is worse), but I know it works.