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E-Bodies Cuda & Challenger (sponsor: ROSEVILLE MOPARTS) => Cuda & Challenger General Discussion (ROSEVILLE MOPARTS) => Topic started by: Topcat on July 25, 2020, 07:36:04 PM

Title: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Topcat on July 25, 2020, 07:36:04 PM
Drove around and met my friend Dave who said I should change my plugs.
Having a slight miss recently found.

Returned home...Pulled it in the Barn and turned it off.

Boom! Fire in the engine.
Smoke started pouring up thru the shaker.

I ran to my trunk, grabbed my ABC extinguisher and put it out.
This all took about  20 seconds from start to extinguished.
Could've lost the house and the car or even I could've been blown up perhaps.

So far: I need to replace...
Forward harness
Distributor cap
Firecore50 Wires
Possibly new heater hoses I just installed
Bubble nose scorched


It looks ignition related. However my splice with shrink tubing was fine.
Still wanting to know why or how it happened.

But most of  all...

THANKFUL!   :worship:
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: mopar jack on July 25, 2020, 07:45:05 PM
Glad you were able to save it. I wonder if the filter below the alternator leaked.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Topcat on July 25, 2020, 08:17:50 PM
Quote from: mopar jack on July 25, 2020, 07:45:05 PM
Glad you were able to save it. I wonder if the filter below the alternator leaked.

Electrical fire, not fuel fire.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: RUNCHARGER on July 25, 2020, 08:32:20 PM
Scarey, good thing you stopped it. I hate the stud on the alternator being so close to a Hemi head. Look for a wire burnt onto a header/manifold as well.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Topcat on July 25, 2020, 09:18:20 PM
One wire on the  back of the Alternator was cooked all the way down.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Cudakiller70 on July 25, 2020, 09:29:44 PM
Wow that's awful but glad you were quick. Ugh electrical fires what a mess.  Hope it cleans up well for ya. Good luck
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: cuda hunter on July 26, 2020, 07:34:01 AM
That's horrible.  Glad your safe. Will the shaker bubble clean up? 

Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Cuda Cody on July 26, 2020, 07:41:34 AM
Holy crappoly.  That is scary.  Glad you're okay.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: njsteve on July 26, 2020, 07:52:13 AM
Do you have collector car insurance? This is definitely a covered event under comprehensive. Make sure you photograph everything. You may want to check the ignition switch wiring as well. I had an electrical fire in a Superbird back in high school (my daily driver at the time). The main alternator wire fried and it acted like a fuse and melted its way all the way up into the steering column to the ignition switch.

I also had a wiring fire in a 71 Hemi Charger. It started at the passenger side valve cover, wiring harness junction block. It seems the factory wiring goes from a 10 gauge to a 12 gauge wire at that junction. It created so much resistance it melted clean through the two plastic wiring junction pieces. I had to cut and splice the two bare wires together by hand, just to get home. It happened in the middle of the NY Tappan Zee Bridge at 2:00 AM. That was a fun ride!
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: floorit426 on July 26, 2020, 08:08:14 AM
 :iagree:

That's happened to me four times, in the 40+years that I've owned my car. I finally bypassed the bulkhead connector and converted over to a voltmeter. Mike, I forwarded you the MAD Electric link.

This is almost like a right of passage, for a Mopar guy, as it is the weakest link, in the electrical system. I'm glad that damages, from your little "fish fry" were limited. Let me know, if you need a hand.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: BFM_Cuda on July 26, 2020, 08:14:51 AM
That really sucks Topcat, glad you had an extinguisher handy. The extinguisher power is very corrosive so try to wash it off ASAP.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Jay Bee on July 26, 2020, 08:16:14 AM
Geez, that just sucks big time. In one breath I'm so sorry for you and in another I'm so glad that you were "Johnny-on-the-Spot".
It's already been said how this could have gone sideways in so many ways. All the best in getting back on the road ASAP.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Topcat on July 26, 2020, 08:47:09 AM
Quote from: cuda hunter on July 26, 2020, 07:34:01 AM
That's horrible.  Glad your safe. Will the shaker bubble clean up?

Minor boils on the nose.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Brads70 on July 26, 2020, 09:03:33 AM
Glad to see the damage was limited somewhat. My buddy Mike with the 71 Hemi Cuda almost had the same issue. It was the wiring harness that was faulty right over the valve cover. Luckily he was right there when it happened with the hood up. Well known harness supplier did replace it but..... check everything, trust no one. 
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: torredcuda on July 26, 2020, 10:00:06 AM
Glad you saved it and kept damage minimal. Possible wire resting on metal rubbed/burnt thru?
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Topcat on July 26, 2020, 10:31:09 AM
I had the alternator off a few weeks ago  when I replaced the heater hoses.
Something re arranged and then finally found the weak spot.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: 7212Mopar on July 26, 2020, 10:38:31 AM
Oh no Mike. Sorry this happened. Hope there is no paint damage. Check for any signs of rodent activity. I am dealing that on my 2012 now. When I got my 73, I found a burned and melted connector on the engine wiring harness and later replaced. I also did the ammeter bypass and ran a fat wire from alternator to the battery. Scary for sure. Hope you get the car fix soon.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: dodj on July 26, 2020, 11:44:40 AM
Well, that really sux! Glad you kept the damage to a minimum.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Topcat on July 26, 2020, 04:17:05 PM
Looks savable. 
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: RzeroB on July 26, 2020, 10:32:40 PM
Holy cow Mike!! Good thing you had the extinguisher handy and had the presence of mind to go get it!! Great save!! I probably would have panicked, ran around in a circle screaming and lost the whole car!!
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: dodj on July 27, 2020, 04:45:55 AM
If your investigations determine the cause, I'd be interested in hearing about it as well as the type of extinguisher you had, since it did the job required of it.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: anlauto on July 27, 2020, 04:53:51 AM
Wow...close call...glad you did what you did... :twothumbsup:
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: 72 Challenger on July 27, 2020, 06:26:05 AM
That's terrifying. Glad you caught it and seem to be in good spirits.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Burdar on July 27, 2020, 06:34:58 AM
You never like to see anyone's car get damaged but when it's a members car it's even worse.  I think a lot of us watched your build thread on CC.com.  It's almost like the car was partly ours too.  Glad the damage was kept to a minimum.  Hopefully it can be fixed relatively quickly.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: YellowThumper on July 27, 2020, 08:54:31 AM
Wow sorry to hear and see this.
Definate lesson for us in quick thinking and being prepared.

Please let us know what you find out. I would start investigating the engine surfaces surrounding the burnt power wire. When cleaning off the retardant, look for spark damage on surfaces. Burning heat rises. If there was spot of ignition from grounding short, it would show that damage.

Good luck.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Topcat on July 27, 2020, 07:35:18 PM
Quote from: dodj on July 27, 2020, 04:45:55 AM
If your investigations determine the cause, I'd be interested in hearing about it as well as the type of extinguisher you had, since it did the job required of it.

ABC Extinguisher.

Main wire on back is the suspect.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: dodj on July 28, 2020, 11:27:28 AM
Quote from: Topcat on July 27, 2020, 07:35:18 PM
Quote from: dodj on July 27, 2020, 04:45:55 AM
If your investigations determine the cause, I'd be interested in hearing about it as well as the type of extinguisher you had, since it did the job required of it.
ABC Extinguisher.
I said type but I meant brand.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: wldgtx on July 28, 2020, 01:04:06 PM
Coming from someone who survived a car fire (different circumstances) First let me say I am glad YOU are okay.

That said, I am glad to hear that you had an extinguisher and were able to stop the fire and possible damage.  It looks fixable and few folks mentioned insurance, and I TOTALLY agree, it is nothing that you should do on your own, that is why you pay for the insurance in the first place.  Best of Luck!
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Shoooter on July 28, 2020, 01:20:57 PM
Glad to see it isnt a complete loss. Very lucky as this could have been alot worse
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: 340challconvert on July 28, 2020, 05:52:46 PM
Topcat
Really glad you were able to contain the damage quickly.
I too worry about the 50 year old wiring on our cars.
I will do the changes necessary to remove the power going through the bulk head.
Definitely a weak spot in our Mopars.
Reminds me of the need to get a fire extinguisher for my garage.
Stay well!
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Topcat on July 28, 2020, 07:18:20 PM
I bought the PowerMaster Alternator.
Which wasn't the problem. (Here's comes the Peanut gallery)

What might've been the igniter, was there wasn't a plastic insulator on the back.
But I drove it like this for...What...5 years?
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Topcat on July 28, 2020, 07:23:40 PM
Quote from: wldgtx on July 28, 2020, 01:04:06 PM
Coming from someone who survived a car fire (different circumstances) First let me say I am glad YOU are okay.

That said, I am glad to hear that you had an extinguisher and were able to stop the fire and possible damage.  It looks fixable and few folks mentioned insurance, and I TOTALLY agree, it is nothing that you should do on your own, that is why you pay for the insurance in the first place.  Best of Luck!




I'm not at a 0% deductible, so being about $300 damage leads to...Just do it yourself.
It's getting friggin Hot out here now.

No car shows so on a wait till September perhaps.
All the parts are ordered this week except  magnetic pick up. (Wire was burned) 

Good news...Dodged a Bullet. Firecore wires look to be re usable.   
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Topcat on July 28, 2020, 07:51:15 PM
Quote from: RzeroB on July 26, 2020, 10:32:40 PM
Holy cow Mike!! Good thing you had the extinguisher handy and had the presence of mind to go get it!! Great save!! I probably would have panicked, ran around in a circle screaming and lost the whole car!!


Ironically, I work in Fire & Sprinkler, & Monitoring inspections for ADT Commercial.




Quote from: dodj on July 27, 2020, 04:45:55 AM
If your investigations determine the cause, I'd be interested in hearing about it as well as the type of extinguisher you had, since it did the job required of it.


It was a  2.5 lb. ABC. which covers many types of combustibles.

Never point the extinguisher at the top of the fire.
Point it just before the base to extinguish and stop Oxygen and Fuel.   ;)   

@CODY knows this stuff I bet.  ;)

http://www.brkelectronics.com/faqs/mro/what-do-the-abc-ratings-mean-on-fire-extinguishers
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Topcat on October 17, 2020, 06:01:26 PM
Well, well, well....   

It's been a while.

So friggin hot in the garage and cleaning extinguisher dust has been delays in firing up the car.

Until today.

Fuel gushing up on fire up today when trying to fire up and was spurting up out of the small hole on top of the fuel pump when cranking over. ECU pick up connector was right above it.

This means the bellows inside the pump, dry rotted out and leaked through to the atmosphere dry side.
Cranking the engine made a Geyser of fuel up which shorted the ECU connector together and that was no doubt what created the engine Harness Fire.

Ethanol sucks!!!!  :foul:
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: RUNCHARGER on October 17, 2020, 07:33:09 PM
Good to figure it out though.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: autoxcuda on October 17, 2020, 07:37:07 PM
Quote from: Topcat on October 17, 2020, 06:01:26 PM
Well, well, well....   

It's been a while.

So friggin hot in the garage and cleaning extinguisher dust has been delays in firing up the car.

Until today.

Fuel gushing up on fire up today when trying to fire up and was spurting up out of the small hole on top of the fuel pump when cranking over. ECU pick up connector was right above it.

This means the bellows inside the pump, dry rotted out and leaked through to the atmosphere dry side.
Cranking the engine made a Geyser of fuel up which shorted the ECU connector together and that was no doubt what created the engine Harness Fire.

Ethanol sucks!!!!  :foul:

Earlier this year had the same exact this in my 68 Barracuda. But no fire.

BTW Edelbrock makes a repair kit rubber for that.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Topcat on October 17, 2020, 07:45:49 PM
@floorit426 (https://forum.e-bodies.org/mlist/floorit426_1567) were hanging out again today and he turned me onto a place that recently Re-did his Carter pump a few months back.

Then & Now Automotive in MA.
https://www.then-now-auto.com/

Apparently they upgrade some of the internal rubber parts. r
Will contact them and re confirm.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Topcat on October 26, 2020, 05:49:17 PM
Was it Ethanol or was it China that caused the fire?

(https://i.postimg.cc/59RcsKZs/Fuel-pump-2.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: YellowThumper on October 26, 2020, 06:37:53 PM
An answer that will never be known...
However, learning the initial cause is much better answer.

Glad you are progressing. Albeit slow.

Mike.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Topcat on October 26, 2020, 07:40:37 PM
This reminds me a lot of Offshore Fishing reels.
They go thru Hell resisting the elements.

The elements just got harder now with Ethanol fuel.
Upgrade is a Must now.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Topcat on October 26, 2020, 08:19:00 PM
3,000 miles away, one week ago, I sent my pump out to Then & Now Automotive in Mass.
Received it today. 7 day turn around at a very affordable price.    :unbelievable:

The pump diaphragm rubber parts they have is Ethanol Resistant.  :yes:

And to get it all done....Replace your accelerator pump boots with the Blue Ethanol resistant foamy's.

Then replace all lower fuel lines with Ethanol resistant rubber. I just bought 5 feet of it online.
Title: Re: Engine Fire on Hemi Today
Post by: Scooter on October 31, 2020, 11:08:24 AM
Glad to see you figured it out and are making progress!  :bigthumb: