Headliner replacement - windows in or out?

[rmchrgr]

The headliner and roof insulation in my Challenger is basically disintegrating so I'm going to replace it. Do the front and rear windows need to come out?

On my Duster, the window gasket sits on top of the retention spike things making it nearly impossible to stretch the fabric onto them evenly. I tried to install a headliner once with the windows in and it was a disaster. A few years later I re-did it with the windows removed and it came out perfect - no question the windows had to be out.

However, since there's no traditional window gasket on an E body, the retention teeth seem to be much easier to access. Plus, they are covered by the window surround trim to hide them.

So how difficult is it to get the material stretched tight and evenly with the windows in? The sides should be no problem, just concerned about the front and rear. Looks doable but I'm not 100% sure as I've never done an E body headliner.

Also, the OE material has a sort of pattern and is not just plain perforated material. Looking at the Legendary website, they call it Weymouth. Is that what I need to get?

Note pattern.

[blown motor]

I had someone replace mine 10 years ago and the windows stayed in. Maybe @jimynick will chime in. I think he did his own.

[rmchrgr]

Thanks. Seems like the windows can stay in but want to confirm before I yank out the old one.

[dodj]

I replaced my headliner with the windows in. Easier with them out...but not 100% necessary