440 build

[SilverFrost73]

Looking for suggestions on my 440 build. Here's the list of parts I'm wanting to use.

Holley 4160 carb
Eddys RPM or Weiand 7512(already have) intake
Stealth heads
440 source rockers
Comp cams push rods
Voodoo 702 or 703 cam and lifters
Speed pro pistons w/valve reliefs to increase CR
Rods and crank(std cast) not sure if stock can handle the increase in HP?
Stall converter 3.23 gears(I want to keep it as low as possible because its a 30 min drive down the hwy to town and I was told the transmission will get hot with a high stall).
Headers(not sure, just don't want clearance and Starter issues).

The car will be used for cruising and a little hot rodding, I wont be running it at the drag strip.
I'd like to take it on a Route 66 run from Idaho and back one day, so I need it to be hwy/city friendly, but also want to show my father in laws LS2 powered 2nd gen camaro up if possible.🤣

I'm not opposed to the 512 stroker kit but the car needs a lot of other parts so Iam on a budget.
Let me know what you more knowledgeable experienced 440 builders think.

[SilverFrost73]

Another question. Will I have to add frame connectors and stronger axles with a 512 stroker build?
Billet input and output shafts on the 727 with stronger driveline and stronger u-joints?
Bigger aluminum radiator to keep it cool?
Will a Carter mechanical fuel pump work or will I need an electric fuel pump, and bigger fuel lines from the tank to the pump/carb (Stock it was a 340 car)?

Sorry for all the questions, I just want to do it right the first time. I don't have $$$ to waste on new unusable parts.

[RUNCHARGER]

I've built tons of engines like this: This is what I would do and have done.
The Speed Pro pistons are too heavy. I used to buy the forged "Six Pack" pistons and then get 100 grams milled out of the bottom of them. Now I spend about the same (including the milling time) and buy these instead.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ros-82008/make/chrysler
I like your camshaft selection, I would use the Performer RPM manifold as long as it will fit under your hood.
I would use those heads ported or I would buy a set of TrickFlow 240's and bolt them on (if they become available again).
This can work nice with a 3.23 gear, I would probably use the larger camshaft and try a 2800 RPM convertor. It may be soggy on the bottom end but it will work great on the highway. Traction is a limiting factor anyway.
Use TTI or Dougs headers, don't waste time with manifolds. I would use a 3 inch exhaust system too, you don't really need 3 inch with this setup but it usually costs the same as 2.5 anyway.
You don't really need subframe connectors especially if you will be using street tires however they have other benefits such as being able to make the car handle better so I would add them anyway.
Stock Chrysler rods and crank can handle the power easily with a build like this (the lighter pistons are a big factor here) but get them crack checked and once you check the stock rods and have new rod bolts put in and resized you might just as well spend the same money and buy new H-beam rods.
I've built quite a few strokers but in an RB application it really isn't necessary on a build like this. One factor up here is fuel cost and I feel you can get all you need with 440 inches and it will get better fuel economy than a 512. That means you'll drive it more. In a Hemi with the increased capacity of the heads I automatically stroke them, but not a 440.
Electric fuel pump is almost necessary with todays gas and carburators, just go past that though and install a Sniper fuel injection from the get go along with the necessary in tank pump and larger fuel lines.
I like using stock Chrysler radiators because if they are in good shape they work. They also have provisions for a fan shroud which I always use. I also use original style fans with a new stock style clutch.
On build like these the stock Chrysler internals of the 727 will hold up just fine as well, Just as long as it is rebuild properly and with good clutches and bands. A bolt in sprag is a good addition, not necessary but put one in anyway  and you'll be safer when you beat on it.
I like stuff stone dependable and I like something I can drive like I stole it from the ex-wife.

This is what has worked for me probably a dozen times now. Chryco Psycho is another really good engine guy on here and he'll offer up his advice as well. Always worth listening too.

[Brads70]

This intake offers great performance and hood clearance. I used it in my 451 build.

https://www.jegs.com/i/Holley/510/300-14/10002/-1?year=1970&make=DODGE&model=CHALLENGER

Proform or quickfuel offer better carbs via adjustability . I've had my quickfuel for 10 plus years now with no issues. No choke either. , we don't use these cars in winter conditions anymore....

https://www.jegs.com/i/Proform/778/67303/10002/-1




@Chryco Psycho

[SilverFrost73]

I've built tons of engines like this: This is what I would do and have done.
The Speed Pro pistons are too heavy. I used to buy the forged "Six Pack" pistons and then get 100 grams milled out of the bottom of them. Now I spend about the same (including the milling time) and buy these instead.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ros-82008/make/chrysler
I like your camshaft selection, I would use the Performer RPM manifold as long as it will fit under your hood.
I would use those heads ported or I would buy a set of TrickFlow 240's and bolt them on (if they become available again).
This can work nice with a 3.23 gear, I would probably use the larger camshaft and try a 2800 RPM convertor. It may be soggy on the bottom end but it will work great on the highway. Traction is a limiting factor anyway.
Use TTI or Dougs headers, don't waste time with manifolds. I would use a 3 inch exhaust system too, you don't really need 3 inch with this setup but it usually costs the same as 2.5 anyway.
You don't really need subframe connectors especially if you will be using street tires however they have other benefits such as being able to make the car handle better so I would add them anyway.
Stock Chrysler rods and crank can handle the power easily with a build like this (the lighter pistons are a big factor here) but get them crack checked and once you check the stock rods and have new rod bolts put in and resized you might just as well spend the same money and buy new H-beam rods.
I've built quite a few strokers but in an RB application it really isn't necessary on a build like this. One factor up here is fuel cost and I feel you can get all you need with 440 inches and it will get better fuel economy than a 512. That means you'll drive it more. In a Hemi with the increased capacity of the heads I automatically stroke them, but not a 440.
Electric fuel pump is almost necessary with todays gas and carburators, just go past that though and install a Sniper fuel injection from the get go along with the necessary in tank pump and larger fuel lines.
I like using stock Chrysler radiators because if they are in good shape they work. They also have provisions for a fan shroud which I always use. I also use original style fans with a new stock style clutch.
On build like these the stock Chrysler internals of the 727 will hold up just fine as well, Just as long as it is rebuild properly and with good clutches and bands. A bolt in sprag is a good addition, not necessary but put one in anyway  and you'll be safer when you beat on it.
I like stuff stone dependable and I like something I can drive like I stole it from the ex-wife.

This is what has worked for me probably a dozen times now. Chryco Psycho is another really good engine guy on here and he'll offer up his advice as well. Always worth listening too.

Thanks for all that great info Runcharger!
The sniper might be an addition in the future but its not in the budget right now. Any suggestions on an electric fuel pump/size?
I'd like it to look as stock as possible, a sleeper you know. 
Are the 26" radiators and shrouds still available? It has one but it looks shot and the shroud is gone.

[SilverFrost73]

This intake offers great performance and hood clearance. I used it in my 451 build.

https://www.jegs.com/i/Holley/510/300-14/10002/-1?year=1970&make=DODGE&model=CHALLENGER

Proform or quickfuel offer better carbs via adjustability . I've had my quickfuel for 10 plus years now with no issues. No choke either. , we don't use these cars in winter conditions anymore....

https://www.jegs.com/i/Proform/778/67303/10002/-1




@Chryco Psycho

Brad thanks for the advice on the intake and carb.
Does the RPM not fit or is it that the SD is better for my application?

[Brads70]

As far as electric fuel pumps go , avoid Holley type
https://www.jegs.com/i/Holley/510/12-801-1/10002/-1

I've had a mallory for 10 plus years also with no issues. They are much quieter  compared to the tradition holley style.
https://www.jegs.com/i/Mallory/650/29256/10002/-1

[SilverFrost73]

Any suggestions on rods, are the scat and eagle rods solid choices?
Also should I bore it .30 over? It's a Std bore '74 HP block.

[Brads70]

Any suggestions on rods, are the scat and eagle rods solid choices?
Also should I bore it .30 over? It's a Std bore '74 HP block.

If your looking to upgrade from the stock parts I'd buy a stroker kit. Proven combo's and cheaper in the long run. 512 with a 440 block, no such thing as too much CID.....

[SilverFrost73]

As far as electric fuel pumps go , avoid Holley type
https://www.jegs.com/i/Holley/510/12-801-1/10002/-1

I've had a mallory for 10 plus years also with no issues. They are much quieter  compared to the tradition holley style.
https://www.jegs.com/i/Mallory/650/29256/10002/-1

Should I increase the size of my stock fuel line size from the tank to the pump/carb?
I would imagine it's the stock size 5/16" or 3/8"?
I've been holding off buying the steel replacement lines because I wasn't sure what I'd need with a bigger carb and more HP.

[Brads70]

As far as electric fuel pumps go , avoid Holley type
https://www.jegs.com/i/Holley/510/12-801-1/10002/-1

I've had a mallory for 10 plus years also with no issues. They are much quieter  compared to the tradition holley style.
https://www.jegs.com/i/Mallory/650/29256/10002/-1

Should I increase the size of my stock fuel line size from the tank to the pump/carb?
I would imagine it's the stock size 5/16" or 3/8"?
I've been holding off buying the steel replacement lines because I wasn't sure what I'd need with a bigger carb and more HP.

Others on here would be better to ask but I'd think 3/8 would be ok with the HP level your looking for. I used 8 AN lines ( 1/2") for both supply and return. I too just wanted to do it once. You will also need a regulator
I've used this site for a few cars I've plumbed with no issues in quality .

https://www.frozenboost.com/index.php?cPath=219&osCsid=6dd5cc73b412f25e6949c519f71b64d3

Of course this is straying from the stock look if that is important to you? 

[SilverFrost73]

Any suggestions on rods, are the scat and eagle rods solid choices?
Also should I bore it .30 over? It's a Std bore '74 HP block.

If your looking to upgrade from the stock parts I'd buy a stroker kit. Proven combo's and cheaper in the long run. 512 with a 440 block, no such thing as too much CID.....

I'm not against going with a 512 kit, just want it to have good street manners and get somewhat good fuel economy 12-15mpg on the hwy for a long trip.
If it's only a $500-1000 more for a stroker kit with all new lower internals then that's a no brainer to me.😊

[Brads70]

Any suggestions on rods, are the scat and eagle rods solid choices?
Also should I bore it .30 over? It's a Std bore '74 HP block.

If your looking to upgrade from the stock parts I'd buy a stroker kit. Proven combo's and cheaper in the long run. 512 with a 440 block, no such thing as too much CID.....

I'm not against going with a 512 kit, just want it to have good street manners and get somewhat good fuel economy 12-15mpg on the hwy for a long trip.
If it's only a $500-1000 more for a stroker kit with all new lower internals then that's a no brainer to me.😊

It's the combo that will give you economy. cam selection, convertor, selection, transmission selection ( od) rear gear.
12-15 should be easy, I'd expect better. I have a 451 , lunati roller HYD cam, 4l60 OD and 4.10 rear gears, best I've got is 18 MPG on the 7 1/2 hour drive to Carlisle.

[SilverFrost73]

Good for you Brad, thats good mileage. Sounds like you have a real nice Challenger.

I value your input.

[SilverFrost73]

If I went with the 512 kit would I still need to use a 2800 stall converter with the voodoo703 cam and 3.23 gearing? That seems like alot of stall for cruising and hwy driving. I don't know much when it comes to converters but I was thinking I'd need something between 2000-2400 stall.