Correct street Hemi Orange engine paint shade?

[B5Cuda440-6]

Dave Walden's Challenger engine was painted with Standox Acrylic Urethane, and is a base/clear system. I would also guess the clear was flattened to achieve the correct level of gloss. I know he spent quite some time to get the correct color/gloss combination.

[6bblgt]

For anyone that is not familiar with Dave's 70 Challenger R/T it received the highest ever score for an OE restoration.

I believe his /6 Valiant exceeded the Challenger's score 

[Cuda Cody]

You talk to 3 different people and you are going to get 3 different answers.  But since you asked me, here's what I think....

Short Answer = The original paint mopar used sucked for engines and it turned a dull sheen as soon as engine was hot.  Today's 2 part paints are far superior and will hold up much better on an engine.  Any auto paint store can mix you up quality 2 part paint in a well known brand so you can shoot the engine with a spray gun.  So by adding flattener to today's quality paints you are trying to mimic the heat damage that is cause to Lacquer and give it a duller look.  I prefer my engines shiny and new looking so I do not add flattener.  But you can add the flattener and it will work really good to make it look dull and more like the original heat soaked Lacquer paint.  The key is to do some test spray outs to get it right.



Detailed Answer = E-Body Mopar engines were originally painted with a Lacquer paint.  Lacquer paint started being used on cars in the 1920's and it slowly started going away in the mid 70's.  Lacquer is a non cross-linked single part paint.  Thus Lacquer is a Thermoplastic paint, or easier to understand terms.... it's soft, not durable, has no hardener, and does not hold up to heat or chemicals.  When used on the outside of a car it take lots of coats and regular polishing to stay looking good.  When used on an engine it looks dull and is horribly affected by the heat.  Single "part" paint (not single "stage" paint, those are two different paints) is also extremely sensitive to chemicals like gasoline.  Gasoline will soften the Lacquer and cause it to loosen up and it will stain or even worse... completely come off.  We've all seen those old cars from the 60's with gas stains running below the fuel filler cap.  That's because it was Lacquer paint.  All the Hemi Orange paint you can buy today in the rattle cans is a single part paint and will not hold up well to heat or gasoline.  Sometime single "part" paint is confused with single "stage" paint.  Single "part" paint is your rattle cans and old lacquers that do not have a hardener.  Single "stage" paint is a modern 2 part paint that has both the paint, hardener and clear mixed in to one.  Then you applied it in one single step or "stage".  It's like base coat / clear coat, but with it all mixed together.

Today we have 2 part paints and they are extremely strong and durable.  2 part paints include your single "stage" and base coat / clear coats.  They are so far superior to the old Lacquer paints that it's hard to put in words.  They are a Thermoset (cross-linked paint), or an easier to understand term.... 2 part paints are chemically bonded so they harden like concrete does.  And we all know once concrete is mixed and dried there is no un-mixing it.  That is the same for today's 2 part paints.  Once you add the hardener it's going to chemically be altered and bond like concrete.  2 part paints are not affect by gasoline so painting your engine with a 2 part paint is the best way to go.  It will hold up extremely well and it handles the heat so much better.  I have thousands of miles on some of my engines that were painted with 2 part paints and they still look new.  The only problem with 2 part paints is you normally have to buy it from a professional paint store and spray it with an automotive paint gun in a paint booth.  You need a good size compressor, and air dryer and a little practice to set up the gun to get it right.  Thus most hobbyist do not use these 2 part paints due to the cost of getting set up to paint.



Solution = This is the first time that I'm aware of that this has been attempted.  You heard it here on E-Bodies.org first.  We are working to provide the correct Hemi Orange paint in a 2 part (paint +hardener) simple and easy to use Rattle Can!  Our first batch of test cans will be here next week and I'm going to start running tests on it.  If it works out the way we plan we will be able to offer to members a correct Hemi Orange paint in a rattle can that will hold up like a professional paint job.  No more need to buy expensive paint guns, airlines with filters and mixing chemicals just to get a professional painted engine.  We plan to sell single cans or complete kits with cleaners, primers, prepping tools and paint.



Here's the cool part...  ALL THE PROFITS WILL GO TO E-BODIES.org!   THAT WAY WE CAN CONTINUE TO PRESERVE AND SHARE MOPAR HISTORY SO FUTURE GENERATIONS WILL HAVE ACCESS TO DETAILED DOCUMENTS, RESOURCES AND AN ARCHIVAL LIBRARY OF RARE PIECES OF INFORMATION.

@Cuda Cody I'm getting ready to paint my 383 using Ditzler EQE-60626 w/ 25% Ditzler DX-265 Flattening Agent. Should I not be using that formula? It's been around for awhile. 

[Shane Kelley]

For anyone that is not familiar with Dave's 70 Challenger R/T it received the highest ever score for an OE restoration.

I believe his /6 Valiant exceeded the Challenger's score 

That's right!  It was probably do to the more desirability of the 6 Valiant that it scored better.

[Cuda Cody]

Here's a perfect example.  This was a guy (Clint Jones) on our Facebook group that shared a photo of his engine after 150 miles.  You can see why I tell people that single part paints (normal rattle can paint) is not a good choice for engine paint.  Here's his comment and photo he posted....

"...My motor is brand new but for some reason the paint never lasted on it. Engine has less than 150 miles on it and looks like crap already"

[Shane Kelley]

   . He's not lying about that! 

[Shane Kelley]

Like Cody. I prefer the high gloss finish also. There is another advantage to high gloss over a flattened finish besides looks. The high gloss has a slick surface that is easier to clean and maintain. When you add flattener it causes a fine texture to the surface. A more likely surface to grab and hold dust, dirt and grim.

[fc7cuda]

Solution = This is the first time that I'm aware of that this has been attempted.  You heard it here on E-Bodies.org first.  We are working to provide the correct Hemi Orange paint in a 2 part (paint +hardener) simple and easy to use Rattle Can!  Our first batch of test cans will be here next week and I'm going to start running tests on it.  If it works out the way we plan we will be able to offer to members a correct Hemi Orange paint in a rattle can that will hold up like a professional paint job.  No more need to buy expensive paint guns, airlines with filters and mixing chemicals just to get a professional painted engine.  We plan to sell single cans or complete kits with cleaners, primers, prepping tools and paint.

Here's the cool part...  ALL THE PROFITS WILL GO TO E-BODIES.org!   THAT WAY WE CAN CONTINUE TO PRESERVE AND SHARE MOPAR HISTORY SO FUTURE GENERATIONS WILL HAVE ACCESS TO DETAILED DOCUMENTS, RESOURCES AND AN ARCHIVAL LIBRARY OF RARE PIECES OF INFORMATION.

Hmm, I'm interested to see how this paint works out/looks and how it will hold up over time.  I would think it's really hard to beat the look and longevity of an evenly applied spray gun engine paint job.   

I'm excited that you're trying it, how can i help?   

[Cuda Cody]

The goal is to perfectly match the look and longevity of a professionally applied spray gun, but in the convenience of a rattle can.

One other thing I'm considering doing is providing two sheen options.   A Show Shine finish for maximum gloss and ease of cleaning and a more original Flat finish for high end OEM restorations.

[B5Cuda440-6]

 

Sounds awesome!! Can't wait to see the test sprays, and the comparisons to survivor engine examples.

Thanks for doing this Cody!

[anlauto]

Wonder if you could mail the spray bombs across the border without any hassle ?

[Cuda Cody]

We can certainly find out what it will take to ship it to Canada.     There's got to be one way or another to get it to you.

I'm going to pick up some more original sample 6 pack lids and 340 valve covers from a buddy that has a huge collection of original stuff.  More original samples and more testing next week.  Hope to have an update after that on the exact results and then start doing some full engine painting tests.

Wonder if you could mail the spray bombs across the border without any hassle ?

[anlauto]

We can certainly find out what it will take to ship it to Canada.     There's got to be one way or another to get it to you.

I'm going to pick up some more original sample 6 pack lids and 340 valve covers from a buddy that has a huge collection of original stuff.  More original samples and more testing next week.  Hope to have an update after that on the exact results and then start doing some full engine painting tests.

Wonder if you could mail the spray bombs across the border without any hassle ?

I think you just mail it as "Automotive restoration supplies"

[Cuda Cody]

Do you have any engines coming up soon that will need to be painted?   

I think you just mail it as "Automotive restoration supplies"

[anlauto]

In a couple of months maybe, but it's always nice to have it on the shelf.....I have an air cleaner lid I could do right now