Trying to Stay Cool - FIXED!!!!

[Cudajason]

I don't mean to hijack the thread but since a lot of people are talking cooling, how much flow should you see in the rad, with the cap removed, when the thermostat is open?

Much like Jason I'm struggling to keep my 340 cool. So far I have put new rad hoses with the spring on it, tried both a 160 and a 180 t-stat (both checked and operational as advertised) but my car also creeps up in temp.

With the rad cap off from a cold start to ~190 degrees, there did not seem to be a lot of flow from where I could see the coolant in the top of the rad. Should it be visibly moving? Mine seems to trickle and when I hit the throttle, it does not pick up much.

Any ideas? I'm not really jazzed at the idea of ripping off my water pump, but right now it seems to be the only unknown.

hey @72 Challenger  as I understand it, you should be able see the coolant moving / flowing in form the top rad hose one the t-stat is open.  If you don't see anything, you may have a problem.

I will try to take some video of min with the current water pump and the new one.

@Cudajason i would bring debt to you if you could post that vid.

Thanks boss!

Hey man no problem, happy to help out. Ill get something up this weekend.

please do not bring me any debt though, i have more than enough already!     Seriously though I get what you are saying and no problem.

Jason

[YellowThumper]

Now that you have a benchmark for cooling ~40° difference.
With that said, if radiator continues to lower temps ~40° regardless of motor temps then for sure it a motor issue or wp issue.
@190° you should see 150° at lower.
@210° you would expect to see 170° at lower.
If this span narrows as motor temp increased then the rad is suspect. They can reach heat soak points that fan(s) cannot overcome.
If span remains consistent then motor becomes issue.

After replacing water pump, don't be surprised if the upper and lower span decreases.
If.... it is water pump not moving enough for motor needs. This would allow water in rad to cool more because of slow moving.
However more flow should help motor requirements at the expense of radiator temp span.

Good luck with this next test.

[Cudajason]

@YellowThumper   thanks man. Good insight. I will report back.

Love @RockAuto got my new water pump today, fast shipping, ordered Monday and delivered to Canada today!!!!

The packing was a little suspect, but it looks like its all in one piece.

I'll have this installed by end of the day Friday!

[blown motor]

Just FYI Jason
Took some readings off my car because the gauge indicated I was running too cool....and I did not believe it..
Lower rad hose: 154* sooo...cooler than yours? Maybe rad not doing it's job effectively?
Tstat housing: 195.6*  (195* tstat)
Temp sender 182*

Thanks man.  I appreciate that.

yes 15 degrees cooler than mine.  However, you are seeing a 20 degree difference in the lower rad hose to the T-stat.

My  T-stat was 209 my lower hose was 169, which is a 40 degree difference.  TO me that indicates the rad is working.  I think you are on to something with the water pump.

I have a new one order (should be here tomorrow).  I will try that next.

Hmmmm195 -154 is 41...... not 20 ...lol   so the same temp difference.   

WOW I really screwed that one up.  that will teach me to work an post at the same time!

And you're an accountant! 

[Cudajason]

Just FYI Jason
Took some readings off my car because the gauge indicated I was running too cool....and I did not believe it..
Lower rad hose: 154* sooo...cooler than yours? Maybe rad not doing it's job effectively?
Tstat housing: 195.6*  (195* tstat)
Temp sender 182*

Thanks man.  I appreciate that.

yes 15 degrees cooler than mine.  However, you are seeing a 20 degree difference in the lower rad hose to the T-stat.

My  T-stat was 209 my lower hose was 169, which is a 40 degree difference.  TO me that indicates the rad is working.  I think you are on to something with the water pump.

I have a new one order (should be here tomorrow).  I will try that next.

Hmmmm195 -154 is 41...... not 20 ...lol   so the same temp difference.   

WOW I really screwed that one up.  that will teach me to work an post at the same time!

And you're an accountant! 

Hey no need for insults.  I just work at an accounting firm, I am not actually an accountant.

Jason

[jimynick]

Is the rad not the only thing getting warmer Jas? 

[72 Challenger]

@YellowThumper   thanks man. Good insight. I will report back.

Love @RockAuto got my new water pump today, fast shipping, ordered Monday and delivered to Canada today!!!!

The packing was a little suspect, but it looks like its all in one piece.

I'll have this installed by end of the day Friday!

Which one did you go with? And how close to "stock" does it look?

Stoked to see how much coolant it flows.

[Cudajason]

Ok folks,

got the gates water pump installed, no big deal, its a pretty simple swap.  While I was initial optimistic, it idled in the drive way for a few mins and never got above 190.

After a short drive last night, that optimism has faded.  Last night was a fairly warm humid night and after 10 mins of driving or so, after the engine warmed up, she climbed quickly to 210 by the time I got home.

So it doe not look like it helped at all.

Video of the flow in the rad with the new pump...not much to see really.

I will take spin later this week during the day and see what it really does, take some for temps with the temp gun and think about next steps.

[7212Mopar]

May be try during around with the hood popped open to let some air out to see if that helps. Don't drive too fast. Upgrade to 26" radiator?

[YellowThumper]

Sorry to hear and see that.
Guess the next lower cost item would be to have radiator rotted out and back flushed.
I understand where you are right now.
Had same issue for years on an early Mustang I have.
Was relegated to short drives only for years.
My issue turned out to be a garbage high dollar custom radiator.
If... you consider the 26" I can show you what I did for mounting it.

[Bullitt-]

  The video is what I would expect to see from a cold motor with the thermostat closed.

What I've seen once the the thermostat is fully opened is a noticeable movement of coolant. 

[YellowThumper]

  The video is what I would expect to see from a cold motor with the thermostat closed.

What I've seen once the the thermostat is fully opened is a noticeable movement of coolant.

Agreed.
I assume with the thermostat open and coolant flowing it is not bubbling over. This tells me you at minimum have enough flow for low rpm.
When motor is at high ish temp. Say 200deg. F. and running, does the upper hose appear excessively pressurized?
Get it up to temp and when idling look at top hose and even squeeze it (carefully its hot) to feel its tension.
Then (parked not moving) bring the rpms up for a bit. Watch hoses. If radiator is flowing proper the top hose should remain the same tightness as felt before. If it feels significantly harder then flow thru it would be suspect. This is what I finally did figuring out my Mustang problem.
Bringing up the RPMs it would become rock hard.
Again, good luck on your endeavor.

[DeathProofCuda]

I was thinking of this thread when I watched this Uncle Tony's Garage video a few days ago.  In it, he talks about "mysterious" overheating issues being caused by a slight drag on your brakes.  Just another thought 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnnbO7WvMEA

If you want to skip ahead, he starts talking about the overheating issue about 4.5 minutes into the video.

[Cudajason]

I was thinking of this thread when I watched this Uncle Tony's Garage video a few days ago.  In it, he talks about "mysterious" overheating issues being caused by a slight drag on your brakes.  Just another thought 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnnbO7WvMEA

If you want to skip ahead, he starts talking about the overheating issue about 4.5 minutes into the video.

Thanks man, I will give it a watch.

  The video is what I would expect to see from a cold motor with the thermostat closed.

What I've seen once the the thermostat is fully opened is a noticeable movement of coolant. 

Yeah I was surprised that there was not more movement.  I waited several mins after it hit 190 (180 T-stat) and that is as good as it got.  I has more steam then flow, you could tell the t-stat opened and hot coolant was flowing in. 

Agreed.
I assume with the thermostat open and coolant flowing it is not bubbling over. This tells me you at minimum have enough flow for low rpm.
When motor is at high ish temp. Say 200deg. F. and running, does the upper hose appear excessively pressurized?
Get it up to temp and when idling look at top hose and even squeeze it (carefully its hot) to feel its tension.
Then (parked not moving) bring the rpms up for a bit. Watch hoses. If radiator is flowing proper the top hose should remain the same tightness as felt before. If it feels significantly harder then flow thru it would be suspect. This is what I finally did figuring out my Mustang problem.
Bringing up the RPMs it would become rock hard.
Again, good luck on your endeavor.

no nothing bubbling over at idle. I will give that a try this weekend.

Sorry to hear and see that.
Guess the next lower cost item would be to have radiator rotted out and back flushed.
I understand where you are right now.
Had same issue for years on an early Mustang I have.
Was relegated to short drives only for years.
My issue turned out to be a garbage high dollar custom radiator.
If... you consider the 26" I can show you what I did for mounting it.

yeah, I may try some evaporust / thermocure and see if that helps, if not I will look at getting the rad cleaned out just to be sure.

The other option I have hear about are these Robert Shaw t-stats,

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/BRA-330-160

Anyone try them, I have heard they can often solve a high heat issue.  I am just running a standard t-stat.

Jason

[Cudajason]

I was thinking of this thread when I watched this Uncle Tony's Garage video a few days ago.  In it, he talks about "mysterious" overheating issues being caused by a slight drag on your brakes.  Just another thought 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnnbO7WvMEA

If you want to skip ahead, he starts talking about the overheating issue about 4.5 minutes into the video.

@DeathProofCuda thanks man, just watched it, thanks for sharing.  At first I thought you were crazy, but after watching it, it make sense.

I can see this being a possibility for me, although I have redone my brakes with new calipers and wheel cylinders and a new master cylinder at least 10 years ago, the lines are all original to the car and the fluid was never flushed.

One of the things I am planning to do this winter it install a hydo-boost brake system and redo all my lines etc. and was planning to switch to Dot 5 fluid. I actually pulled a hydro-boost unit from the wreckers last Friday.

Maybe I will try a few more low cast options, different t-stat and flush everything out really good this summer and then see what happens after I redo the brake system.  I bet it will be pretty apparent once I pop a piston out of a caliper if that is a problem.

Thanks again man, sharing info like this is what makes this site awesome!