Actual Production Date VS "Scheduled Production Date"

[Cuda Cody]

Yes    Original 11- 1969 door mylar sticker. 

HEMI Challenger R/T JS23R0B201xxx assembly line #2 B25-SPD; November is the #2 most productive month & line #2 was running ~85 cars per hour (it does have an "11-1969" door sticker, correct?)

[6bblgt]

"cataclysm80"
1970 340 'cuda BS23H0B393xxx with a 625-SPD (Friday June 25) I'm getting close on June BEST BET "In Plant/In Process" on Tuesday June 22, 1970  +/- a day = EARLY

June was not a big Barracuda month only 2,696 Plymouth E-bodies - ALL at Hamtramck, MI
the #9 production month (of 12) for the 1970 model year
***** (June was the most productive month for Chrysler Corp. 1970 model year 172,000+ cars total all 8 car plants)

[cataclysm80]

Simply Amazing Dan! 
Thank You So Much! 

It makes me curious how you figured out the actual production date from the info given.
I'm guessing this is something that would require a lot of data on build sheet sequence numbers or something?
Maybe the time stamp would provide a clue?

[Cuda Cody]

That makes perfect sense as this sheet was found in a different car built on March 17th!     Nicely done!!!!

"Cuda Cody"
1970 Challenger T/A JH23J0B276xxx with a 313-SPD (Friday March 13) was "In Plant/In Process" on Tuesday March 17, 1970  = LATE

this Challenger T/A was among 5,961 Dodge e-bodies built during the month of March combined at both the Hamtramck, MI & Los Angeles, CA assembly plants
the #5 (of 12) most productive month of Challenger production for the 1970 model year

[6bblgt]

I added a broadcast sheet to the reference thread https://forum.e-bodies.org/vin-fender-tag-build-sheet-and-date-codes/13/e-body-broadcast-sheet-reference-library-just-scanned-broadcast-sheets-please/804/msg21929#msg21929
for a low-OPTION'd A93 fixed 1/4 window '70 Barracuda coupe - it has a 402-SPD but for whatever reason was not built until much later in the month almost 3 weeks LATE

my calculations put it "In Process/In Plant" on April 20

[cataclysm80]

I really like that A93 Barracuda!

[cataclysm80]

OK Dan, I just posted a couple sheets in the other thread, and would LOVE to hear whatever you can tell me about them.

The first sheet with 825 SPD goes with a friends car.  (found in passenger seat)
The second sheet with 826 SPD was found in that same car.   (found in rear seat)

Does this mean both cars were actually built on the same day?


Part 2:  I don't have a broadcast sheet for my own 70 Challenger with an 826 SPD.  Does the 826 broadcast sheet reveal anything about my own car? 
My car has a lot in common with both the other cars.  All 3 cars are JH23, & EF8 paint with H6F8 interior, and seem to be built together.
My VIN is 153 apart from the other 826 car, for whatever that's worth.
I'd be particularly interested in hearing about any additional cars built on that day, and any information it might suggest about my own car.
I think my friend knows what dealership his car sold at new, and I'm wondering if there's anything to indicate whether mine was in the same region (which happens to be near my wife's home town).
Here's my fender tag.  (never mind the cheap repaint)
My car is power steering with the standard woodgrain wheel, Air conditioning with all the windows factory tinted, 8.75 rear with 2.76 gears, manual drum brakes on all 4 wheels, 318 with 904 transmission. 
(had an engine block heater in it, though I'm not sure how to tell if that's factory or not)

[6bblgt]

the 2 Challenger sheets posted are from Assembly Line #2 (the big line) it appears they were building cars at almost twice the rate of Line #1

does your friend's Challenger have a door sticker?  Right now my data would suggest they were "In Process/In Plant" on the last production day of August (Friday 8/29/69), but it is quite possible they are first production day of September (Tuesday 9/2/69)

the door sticker would be the key ..... 

[6bblgt]

OK Dan, I just posted a couple sheets in the other thread, and would LOVE to hear whatever you can tell me about them.

The first sheet with 825 SPD goes with a friends car.  (found in passenger seat)
The second sheet with 826 SPD was found in that same car.   (found in rear seat)

Does this mean both cars were actually built on the same day?

Yes, IMO they were 14 cars apart on the assembly line

Part 2:  I don't have a broadcast sheet for my own 70 Challenger with an 826 SPD.  Does the 826 broadcast sheet reveal anything about my own car? 
My car has a lot in common with both the other cars.  All 3 cars are JH23, & EF8 paint with H6F8 interior, and seem to be built together.
My VIN is 153 apart from the other 826 car, for whatever that's worth.
I'd be particularly interested in hearing about any additional cars built on that day, and any information it might suggest about my own car.
I think my friend knows what dealership his car sold at new, and I'm wondering if there's anything to indicate whether mine was in the same region (which happens to be near my wife's home town).

your friend's Challenger was a Y14 "ordered car", your car does not appear to be ordered from the same dealership - but it could've been a "sales bank" car that ended up there

I'll see what else I can come up with .....

[cataclysm80]

does your friend's Challenger have a door sticker?  Right now my data would suggest they were "In Process/In Plant" on the last production day of August (Friday 8/29/69), but it is quite possible they are first production day of September (Tuesday 9/2/69)

the door sticker would be the key .....

Yes, his door sticker says August,  here's a pic.
His car sold new on September 13th 1969, at Mount Vernon Motors in Indiana, sold by Paul Page, to a woman who purchased a Factory Service Manual and kept meticulous notes. 

My own car did not have a door sticker when I got it. 

[6bblgt]

@cataclysm80  I haven't found any additional clues for your car, but here's a car close/similar to your friend's Challenger - this one was in northeast Ohio ~20 years ago.

[cataclysm80]

Thank You Very Much Dan!! 

I shared the info with my friend, and he says Thank You also.

He had a question.
Do the 724 & 751 time stamps on those sheets meant that the cars were built in the morning?


He also had an unrelated question about his 1971 Superbee if you happen to know anything about those.
He is wondering why his VON on the fender tag begins with a D.
383, 3 speed manual trans, bench seat, manual drum brakes, road wheels
front/rear bumper guards, fender mounted turn signal indicators, dual chrome mirrors, door edge guards, red with white interior.

He's under the impression that D was used on Driver's Training vehicles, but this car was never used for that purpose.
It sold new at Carter Sales & Service Inc. in Wabash Valley Indiana. 
The lady that worked there then remembers the car and said that they got discounts and tax breaks for driver training vehicles, but never ordered anything other than 4 door cars for the driver training program.
It was the only 71 Superbee sold at that dealership that year. They said it was sold as soon as the tires hit the ground.  It stayed local there for many years.
It was built in September, but he doesn't have a Broadcast sheet.

He says the Superbee registry has one other 71 Superbee with a D VON.  It's a yellow Sunroof car, also built in September.

[6bblgt]

each plant "handled" the SEQENCE NUMBER on the top left of the broadcast sheet a little differently, at Hamtramck 1970:

the SEQUENCE NUMBERs appear to be the build order based on the print time & the print time is based on a 24 hour & 100 "minute" clock
I believe the print time stamps 724 (7:14AM) & 751 (7:31AM) represent a time when the car build was released to the production floor (or something similar).  Broadcast sheet is the starting point & door sticker is the finished point.

still getting conflicting info on how many shifts it would take to build a complete car from start to finish - I believe the biggest issue is the fact that staffing and output varied from plant to plant & year to year (even month to month)

best guess at this point: Line #2 Hamtramck
for the month of August '69 ~6350 cars built
running 2 shifts at the end of the month

Driver's Education is the only reference I've seen in respect to a "D" VON prefix.

[cataclysm80]

I believe the print time stamps 724 (7:14AM) & 751 (7:31AM) represent a time when the car build was released to the production floor (or something similar).  Broadcast sheet is the starting point & door sticker is the finished point.
still getting conflicting info on how many shifts it would take to build a complete car from start to finish - I believe the biggest issue is the fact that staffing and output varied from plant to plant & year to year (even month to month)

best guess at this point: Line #2 Hamtramck
for the month of August '69 ~6350 cars built
running 2 shifts at the end of the month

If I remember all of this correctly (hopefully I saved a copy of the conversation), Dave Walden got permission from Chrysler to make reproduction broadcast sheets, and did quite a bit of research into what would be required for that project.  In the end, he was confident in his ability to make accurate sheets, but decided not to make them because he didn't like what he thought it would do to the hobby.  As part of his research for correct fonts, he tracked down a guy that repaired the broadcast sheet printers on the assembly line, and learned exactly what model of printers they were, etc.  One of the things the printer repair guy said was that there were broadcast sheet printers at the beginning of every different department along the assembly line.  Each car had a broadcast sheet for every different department, but most of those sheets are thrown away during production.  The sheets which we usually find in cars are from the trim shop when the interiors are done, which is closer to the end of the line than the beginning.
If we could see the different broadcast sheets from each department, they'd have different time stamps according to when the car entered that department.   (maybe also different line sequence numbers if the line order was rearranged for some reason, like if a car was pulled aside for repair work?)
Some of the engineers from Lynch Road have said that it took 2 days to get a car from the metal shop onto a transport truck in 1970.
I'm not sure how that would compare to Hamtramck production speed, but I have to wonder,  If these green Challengers were all passing through the trim shop at the end of the assembly line during the early morning of August 29th, maybe they could have actually been in the metal shop on August 26th where the SPD on the fender tag was stamped?

It makes me wonder, How did we come to the conclusion that the date on the fender tag was only a Scheduled date instead of the Actual date that the car was in the metal shop.
Production seems to be a multiday process, longer if something goes wrong.
Have we ever seen an instance where a broadcast sheet indicates the car was built BEFORE the fender tag SPD?  That would pretty much rule out the SPD as being an actual date.

Sorry I'm so full of questions.   

Driver's Education is the only reference I've seen in respect to a "D" VON prefix.

I've also heard somewhere that D was used on 1970 WH41 Senior Citizen Special cars sold in Jacksonville FL, but that's definitely not this Superbee. 


Many Thanks Again for all of your help!!

[Cuda Cody]

   I love hearing everyone thoughts on this kinda of stuff.  The more we all share and brainstorm, the better the hobby is.  Thanks for all your thought Tavis.