Header and idler arm clearance

[GoodysGotaCuda]

IMO just dent the header. The engine is going to move on the mounts when launching or making hard shifts and it could contact again. The last thing you want is locked steering because the header came over on it weird.

The dent will not lose and power and it's the most for sure way to know you maintain clearance regardless where the steering or the engine is. If you press it like I mentioned, you may not even crack the ceramic coating much at all


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[nsmall]

Im cheering for you.  Them there headers cost a small fortune.  I hope you can find another solution.  TTI sent me the wrong headers last month.  Maybe confirm you have the right part numbers on them?  They corrected their mistake.

[1 Wild R/T]

Shimming motor mounts, the shim goes between the mount & the bracket, make the shim out of 2" x  1/4" steel flat bar.... A 1' piece of material from the scrap bin of any welding shop will make four shims.....  Cut it into 3" lengths, locate & drill one 1/2" or slightly bigger hole....

[HP_Cuda]

Scroll down to shim packs, although these are out of stock that is what I would go with.

http://www.engine-swaps.com/Pages/ProductsYear/67.72aBody.html

[shawge]

Before you take a tool to the headers, is the motor in the correct location?  Experienced this w/ my 451, Dougs headers, and the L-side TB.   Made my own shims.

center of crankshaft to top of k-frame: 5-1/4"
center of crankshaft to each frame rail, difference should be 2-1/2" (engine is offset towards R-side)

From TTI instruction:
First check your Engine Location
K members are not all identical and the dimensions must be checked to
ensure  proper  fit. Check  your  engine  location  prior  to  installation  of  your  TTI  Headers.
TTI  Headers  were  designed to fit with the engines located to the factory specifications.
If the engine is not located correctly in the chassis, the headers will not fit properly.
If necessary, place shims between the insulator assembly and the K-frame  mounting  pad
to  achieve  the proper  dimensions. Shim  kits  and  engine  mounts  can be  purchased from
Schumacher Creative Services of Seattle, WA (206) 364-7151

[usraptor]

Thank You guys!      I will either buy or make some shims to solve the problem.  Your advice, as always is much appreciated to this novice! 

[7212Mopar]

I made shims out of some scrap metal plate, 1/16 to about 1/8. Cut to about the size and width of the motor mount. Drill a hole for the motor mount stud. Only have to lift the engine slightly to drop in place. I held it with a magnet while lowering the engine. Actually did this for the motor mount curvature issue. It would not work for my interference between header and oil pan but your interference is with the suspension.

[HP2]

Reangling the steering box only makes the effect equal from side to side it doesn't change the fact the geometry has been altered....  But as mentioned before it's possible the geometry will be improved... (not likely)  Bringing the drag link down means in order to set the Toe to spec the tie rod needs to be shortened... Typically on Mopar's the tie rods are already to short which is why a bump steer correction kit will give you a way to drop the outboard tie rod location which will lengthen the tie rod...

I get that and in my cars I alter the set up to create the best and most equal geometry possible. However, it has been my experience that many stock mopars have anywhere from .125 to .625 inch worth of deviation in height between the  idler and pitman arms because the idler position is fixed and the steering box is shimmed. Ideal, no, detrimental, unlikely, but it can be fixed. To go all the way to a bump steer correction kit for a condition the factory shipped out regularly is obviously a good, but an expensive solution, and may not be necessary, especially if the car is used as a casual cruiser. If USRaptor wants to know if it will improve the geometry, a simple measurement between the ground and the pitman and idler will immediately tell if there is a difference between them and if the adjusting of the height pitman can either proceed or should be avoided.  Yes, mopar tie rods are short, but these too can be  modified to gain the extra thread adjustment if needed by trimming off some of the ends.

Still looking for an answer regarding grinding off 1/32 to 1/8' off the top of the idler arm as shown in above post/pictures.

There is probably enough casting flash on those to do a /32 and squeak by for now. But over time, the motor mount will compress further and create interference again. getting too aggressive on grinding could lead to a thin spot and failure.

For shims, you can remove the isolator and stack washers on it's studs, which reduces the contact area. You can also add flat stock to the brackets to allow the isolator to rest on them. This is how I did my spacers to have a greater contact area between the mount and isolator. A lot of work, yes.

You also could try loosening the engine and trans mount and lifting and resetting the engine, possibly rolling it more to one side by a fraction of an inch. There is not a lot of slack in between all the brackets, isolators, and mounts, but it may all add up to enough if they can all move a little.

If I was in your shoes, I'd first check ground to joint height of both the pitman and idler where the connect to the center link.  If the pitman is higher, then shim the steering box down and inspect your idler contact. If they are equal,IMO, you could still shim the box down to see if it improves and not be any worse off than factory. However, in the interest of preserving good geometry, you could leave them as is and try repositioning the engine or shimming the  motor mount(s).

[Brads70]

In addition to the mentioned solutions , you could also shim the transmission. It's far enough away and little goes a long way..... 

What is the condition of the transmission mount?" 

[jordan]

I had the same issue.  I just turned the idler out of the way and hit it with a rounded off steel rod and  three pound hammer until the header dimpled enough to easily clear the idler.  It took 10 minutes and I have no issues.  I have never had anyone look at my car and ask if my header has a dimple.  If your car is a correct trailer queen show car then go through the work to shim the motor, but if you drive it and are not getting it judged, keep it simple.  You won't care eventually, especially if your car is working correctly. 

[usraptor]

What is the condition of the transmission mount?" 

It's new.

[GoodysGotaCuda]

I had the same issue.  I just turned the idler out of the way and hit it with a rounded off steel rod and  three pound hammer until the header dimpled enough to easily clear the idler.  It took 10 minutes and I have no issues.  I have never had anyone look at my car and ask if my header has a dimple.  If your car is a correct trailer queen show car then go through the work to shim the motor, but if you drive it and are not getting it judged, keep it simple.  You won't care eventually, especially if your car is working correctly.

I agree. I was driving mine yesterday and encountered an unavoidable rock in the road, I added another custom dent to my TTI header.  Stuff happens!

[Chryco Psycho]

I would just pull the idle out see if you cam shim it down in the mount or bend the ears of the mount down to lower the arm or oval the lower hole a little & twist the arm downward before I would try anything else , shimmint the back of the trans should help out too

[Brads70]

Wow I was able to copy this from my Photobucket account! Hope it helps....

[usraptor]

Thanks Chyrco and Brad.  Brad re  picture one, is it showing that the distances between L1, L2 and R1 and R2 to the floor are the same or is there some exact measurement that does with them?  If there is an exact measurement, I would think things like ride height, tire size, etc. could effect that measurement.

Re photo no. 3, I can tell for sure, but the part they are saying to shim, is that the steering box? 

thanks again.